TheBoysInTheLab
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Sometimes bad things are worth knowing.
FP Edit: Based on the comment section, I think I used the Puffin correctly? It is interesting that people were suggesting a lot of other good reading material as "instead" not "in addition to"
mobiustwo
Thought that's what animal farm was for?
CaffeineManic
jurjclooners
I think the good/evil divide is just a lazy way of thinking. Hitler had good intentions for Germany, at least it started that way. 1/2
jurjclooners
In times of war everybody is to blame. Everyone is good and everyone is evil.
Illthinkofausernamelater
Animal Farm would be better. It shows the slow progress from "for the people" to "damn the people, for yourself" better than most.
ValentineN
We have 1984 and Fahrenheit 451, but you know what? People look at them as manuals instead.
lordbucket
It's terribly dull and poorly written. You're more likely to inspire people to hate reading than teach them to recognize evil.
AbstractBettaFish
1/ Mein Kamph is so esoteric it’s almost unreadable to modern audiences. Unless you’re intimately familiar with grievances of late
AbstractBettaFish
/2 19th century Germany, you’re not going to get a lot out of it
Maboroshi1994
it was considered incomprehensible then too.
Jomini001
Have YOU read it? It's crazy and disjointed. People didn't flock to the Nazi party because of that book any more than they flocked to barack
Jomini001
Obama because of "dreams of my father". People were told what they wanted to hear, that their problems weren't their fault and that the
Jomini001
NAZI's knew how to fix the problems plaguing Germany, and they believed it. They kept believing it because the NAZI's actually delivered
Jomini001
On many things such as creating. A massive welfare state, ensuring every man had a job (at least making it appear so) and fighting to
Jomini001
Reclaim lost german land and national honor. The power of the book was only that some of the most disaffected and marginal empathized
Jomini001
With subject of that 7-800 page whinging autobiography.
Aathole
Thats a really good idea.
tazednconfused
DerRattenfngerVonHameln
"Mein kampf" is poorly-written, has some strange ownership rights and actually prohibited in many countries. These are major complications.
InJenius
Philosophical works tend to be more powerful imo. Descartes, Socrates, Thoreau, Nietzsche, Lao Tzu, etc. Much wiser than their times.
Dingus2
If you want to see shit get real then require a coherent report on the works of Carl Jung for HS graduation.
Ozymander
I've read it. Very hard to read. Not because of vocabulary or ideas, but it's basically rambling one paragraph to the next.
tzap
Lol.. You wont learn anything whatsoever from Mein Kampf. It has no literature value. It's just a mismatched mess of populist ideas.
crocostyle
This is a proper puffin. I know plenty of folks who would say it's too controversial, and that plenty of alternatives exist.
TheBoysInTheLab
Yep. And they all showed up here!
BayazTheBenevolent
I get the feeling OP hasn't actually read Mein Kampf. Protip: It's shit. A rambling mess of ideas and misdirected anger.
BayazTheBenevolent
No need to waste your time reading that garbage. Just read a summary and spend your time reading actually good literature.
reddocs
You could also read contemporary exiled german writers, or the ones fom the period after the war ("Trümmerliteratur"). F.e Erich Hackl
PopeyeTheSailor
i shall read this in Mein Kampfy chair
BLONALD
So should Machiavelli's The Prince and most of the Socratic Dialogues. Won't happen, but it should.
Fennecks
The prince was required reading for my political literature class in highschool.
CandidGamera
Nah (and I'm a history teacher). People think Mein Kampf is this masterpiece of manipulative deception, and it's really not. It's blatant ->
JHawke
Even if it was, most people aren't going to pick up that specific lesson anyways. They'll think the important message is hunting jews, or >
JHawke
> kamps are fun, or cloud are blue.
FLOPPYDONKEYDICK
Don’t underestimate the stupidity of the masses, just look at the United States. :)
CandidGamera
<-supremacist ravings that appealed to the sensibilities of contemporaries ("Yeah, why shouldn't Germany just conquer the space she ->
DonnaNobleInTheLibrary
"The Negro is inferior to the Arian in every respect, but they have giant dicks that our women crave." I ... err ... okay then.
Nuttsy
Wait, that's actually in the book?
DonnaNobleInTheLibrary
I paraphrased, because he rambles on for half a page, but yes. That's actually in the book.
Nuttsy
...fucksake, Adolf.
CandidGamera
<-needs?") and if anything it's more appealing in today's climate of political doublespeak due to its bluntness. Mein Kampf also played a->
CandidGamera
<-comparatively minor role in Nazi voter mobilization. If you want to learn about manipulation study Hitler's election campaigning methods.
SmolRat
But that’s exactly why it should be required reading, so people realize what to look out for rather than having some nebulous idea of 1/?
SmolRat
this masterfully manipulative “evil” worked up in their head as the thing to look out for. 2/2
Maboroshi1994
yeah the book itself is like reading a bad alt-right youtube rant. the only thing you could say is that it predicted everything he did.
o4kill
Yeah, I was taught in school that the world didnt have a good excuse "We didnt know he was going to be that bad" when he wrote it all down.
WhistlingButt
MrMuchoMachoMan
The bible will also provide. I’m reading/listening old testament now and I’ve encountered every aspect of life (evil inkluded) so far.
bryancKing
That's exactly what a Hitler in disguise would say to sell more books!
alderaanismyhomeplanet
I majored in WWII history and my professor who taught German history & was from Germany, admitted that he could not get himself to read it.
SmolTenk
read parts of it, its not really "good" in any way.
wqpsu
It's just so horrible. It rambles on and on, you can skip ahead a dozen pages at a time and not miss a beat.
inspiringandfunnyusernamecoolheh
Partly because it was until 2015 completely forbidden in Germany.
Maboroshi1994
untrue. in germany the lit from the era is available to academics for those purposes. it wasn't SOLD, true. but it was available.
plebeiusmaximus
It wasn't forbidden, Bavaria held the copyright and didn't want to do reprints. I think some Uni libraries had old copies.
DonnaNobleInTheLibrary
You could also get German reprints e.g. in the UK and bring them back home legally. Just not buy or sell it in Germany.
Maboroshi1994
it was available for proper use, like academic purposes and such
h0tdoglatte
if people know history, how will they be fleeced into repeating it?
OptimisticDownvoteLover
Believe me, even if we knew history, we'd still manage to "repeat" it somehow.
Dingus2
“We learn from history that we do not learn from history.”
CandidGamera
By letting them think "Since I know history, I'm too smart to repeat it" and claim that "circumstances are different today" and "it's not ->
CandidGamera
<- torture/genocide/imperialism/totalitarianism if WE do it."
StarmineRendezvous
You were downvoted, I helped ya out. It's just like idolism/Nationalism/etc, get people gung-ho for something, and they become blind.
Dingus2
How do you propose to teach people history? We're way too busy not teaching our kids how to read and do basic math.
Cheomesh
I've read it. It's mostly a rambling mess. I suspect lots of it doesn't translate well.
Absani
Has nothing to with translation. Having read the original copy I found in my Grandmas house after she passed, it simply is poorly written.
CandidGamera
If the translation seems like a rambling mess, then the translation's on point, believe me.
Maboroshi1994
it reads like the 1920's equivalent of an alt-right youtube rant. even in german. hitler was a terrible writer.
MerToo
that's more "suspect" than most of the clowns in these comments bothered to apply.
snarflex
Unfortunately many people read Marx and Lenin and it has the opposite effect it should.
KyleBeach
Mainly because they read them without any proper knowledge of the grander scope of society. To a bleeding heart liberal, pure communism
KyleBeach
sounds great, except many never think about it's big flaws like what happens when the gov't takes all and doesn't adequately support it's
KyleBeach
people like the model suggests it needs to.
Dingus2
Agreed, but if we can do without the epithet and perhaps emphasize it by pointing out the similar dysfunction at the other end I think ->
Dingus2
-> people who may need to hear it will be more likely to listen. The difficult thing about watching the modern divisiveness is that people->
Digsby
SerDire
Fun fact: Henry Ford received a Nazi medal, the Grand Cross of the German Eagle and is the only American mentioned by name in Mein Kampf
ForMyOwnAmusement
with good reason https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/daily/nov98/nazicars30.htm
dhulqarnayn
That's not surprising if you know anything about Henry Ford.
Oatmealer
All anyone needs to know is Animal Farm and It’s The Great Pumpkin Charlie Brown.
rindawg
Agreed. Dystopian fiction can teach how to spot evil much better than Mein Kampf.
Galhaar
And then Homage to Catalonia just to stop dipshits from saying Orwell wrote in favor of capitalism
Imightbethedroidyourelookingfor
What do you mean, The Great Pump..k..in.......Oh My God.
GapingAnalCavity
Animal farm would be particularly apt today. I'd add Brave new world to the list as well. Seems more accurate than 1984.
lostnortherner
Throw in Brave New World then read and watch The Handmaid's Tale. That shit's terrifying.
SecretlyASiberianHusky
And hopefully those two texts aren’t related.
vampyrita
the great pumpkin?
strawberrycocoa
Great Pumpkin as a metaphor for how religion is an empty shell that leaves you disappointed and unfulfilled?
WhyDontYouMakeMe
I'm trying to figure out the Great Pumpkin one, is it something to do with unflinching belief?
Wyndynwyre
Has to do with the size and hue of our president's head, I believe.
CriManSquaFandCdoubletime
GaryDang3r
Also 1984 by Orwell aswell, so many things that seem happening somewhere right now
Dingus2
https://www.amazon.com/Ordinary-Men-Reserve-Battalion-Solution/dp/0060995068
GaryDang3r
Thanks I might give it a try, especially because I am German.
ona2master
Can you explain for me. My friend gets it, but I'm dumb
6480K
I... I think the pumpkin is a Trump reference...
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WhyDontYouMakeMe
Everything is a JoJo's reference, just put "isn't there a stand that..." in front of every question. 99% of the time, there is one
Oatmealer
Don’t waste your time sitting in a Pumpkin patch waiting for The Great Pumpkin just because someone told you it was coming.
Weentit
thank you
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WhyDontYouMakeMe
Yeah, Animal Farm is about as subtle as a howitzer. It's fair to assume we got that part of it, but what about the Great Pumpkin?
efhawthorne
That's not much of an explanation.
GaySocialistLiberalMuslimCommieAtheist
Animal farm is literally just the coommunists rise to power stylised as farm animals taking over a farm. No it makes no sense to me either.
WhyDontYouMakeMe
Animal Farm is the clear political analogue, we want to know how Charlie Brown and Linus translates into political ideology
glovelyday
Read a synopsis. The book is garbage. Racist hate mongering garbage.
TheS4ndm4n
"Jews bad, Arians good. Details inside"?
gifsaregifsnotgifs
thats OPs point. its easier to see what true evil is if you know what it looks like
glovelyday
It's a mistake to to imagine we can recognize the evil by their horns. Holocaust was done by middle managers following orders, not monsters
gifsaregifsnotgifs
some may have been following orders, some may have believed in the cause. it may not represent all evil but understanding every bit helps.
glovelyday
As Hannah Arendt termed it "the banality of evil" is what we must fear, not scary monsters. The Milgram Experiment showed all can do evil.
TheBoysInTheLab
I think it should be part of history and poli sci, not lit. It is pure garbage as literature. But it should be viewed in context.
BayazTheBenevolent
The context being vastly more important than the work itself, which is why there's really no need to read the whole thing.
TheBoysInTheLab
The problem with cherry picking the "interesting" parts is that it seems more important. Once I read it Neonazis just made me sad not angry.
KyleBeach
The problem is, the book isn't even a main focal point of how germany ended up where it did, a few decades of shit happening and a man who
KyleBeach
although a sick bastard, was one hell of a campaigner. Mein Kampf is like observing the doodles of a psych ward patient to find out their
KyleBeach
crazy when years of medical history can tell you far more without staring at garbage all day.
glovelyday
You don't need a o read the whole to do that. A sip from a quart of sour milk is enough to tell you it's bad, don't have to drink it all.
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YeahWellAboutThat
Yes, but that had f*ck all to do with one book. Analyze propaganda material, speeches and actions in context (when,where,audience) instead.
AxelYamanaka
I think he convinced them using cookies made with the sour milk, not the sour milk itself.
reverendleonard
Hi, I heard someone mentioned cookies?
glovelyday
Totally true. And in that sense reading a history of the Weimar Republic and studying the conditions where he flourished is more valuable.
JackDawesLovesmybigwhat
Don't forget his big hard man-crush on Martin Luther.
AxelYamanaka
He also drank water and had a dog, while we're listing random facts about him
JackDawesLovesmybigwhat
Hell, I thought it was relevant. a big part of that book was him explaining his antisemitism Influnced by studying Luther.
JackDawesLovesmybigwhat
Or I think so.. it's been so many years.
AxelYamanaka
While true, i think that simply stating he was a fan of luther is a bit disingenuous. It'd like if gallileo liked burnt toast and 1/
AxelYamanaka
2/ someone was a fan of his because of that, and then went on to create an empire of bad taste. To then link galileo to this emphasises
nelshai
Your comparison feels disingenuous at best seeing as how it's not as unrelated since Martin Luther was also an antisemite.
Schacknado
Seems you have a very black and white view of good and evil. Maybe we should teach that life isn't that simple instead?
IdeaOfLove
You're right. He was evil, but he was also a man. And people need to realize that, had they been in Nazi Germany, they'd likely be Nazis.
Maboroshi1994
yeah, or else. dissent got you beaten, arrested or worse.
AllahuAkbarDubstepRemix
After starving with no job in a shattered country for years, you'd be surprised how faithful you'd be to see it rise to prosperity again
baconandplagues
Nah, Hitler was most certainly an evil cunt. There's no shades of grey there.
AliensXenomorph
Interesting how you can disregard "there are no absolutes" when it is politically correct to do so.
baconandplagues
Nah, Murdering millions is pretty fucking evil. Nothing to do with political correctness shit dick
Schacknado
Your comment does not reveal a lot about Hitler but it sure does about you.
baconandplagues
Yup, that I think Hitler was a worthless piece of shit that murdered millions, which he was.
baconandplagues
I don't think you understand how the real world works, but when you spearhead an ethnic cleansing, you're pretty much the lowest