TrumpsBrainCell
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Terry Pratchett wrote a great example of this in one of his discworld books. It's about a city guard who's walking the streets every day. He grew up poor but ends up marrying a rich woman and suddenly has money.
Here's the part:
"The reason that the rich were so rich, Vimes reasoned, was because they managed to spend less money.
Take boots, for example. He earned thirty-eight dollars a month plus allowances. A really good pair of leather boots cost fifty dollars. But an affordable pair of boots, which were sort of OK for a season or two and then leaked like hell when the cardboard gave out, cost about ten dollars. Those were the kind of boots Vimes always bought, and wore until the soles were so thin that he could tell where he was in Ankh-Morpork on a foggy night by the feel of the cobbles.
But the thing was that good boots lasted for years and years. A man who could afford fifty dollars had a pair of boots that'd still be keeping his feet dry in ten years' time, while the poor man who could only afford cheap boots would have spent a hundred dollars on boots in the same time and would still have wet feet.
This was the Captain Samuel Vimes 'Boots' theory of socioeconomic unfairness."
Too many people don't understand/care about what the word society means and instead have bought wholesale into the immense selfishness their leaders have instilled while robbing them blind.
I don't know how you can call a country great when it's that miserable.
whitegirlcanteven
It's almost like Capitalism is a system that requires exploitation and maybe it's not a great way to operate a society that values humanity.
Jewdakris
This is big with food also, if you can't afford better food you are hurting yourself in the long run with medical problems you can't fix.
Belgiddybleh
When I would say "I'm broke" that meant i already dug through the couch for change. Later I realized for most people at work that meant...
Belgiddybleh
"I'm unwilling to touch my savings or use my credit card for this." "This" being a new shirt or coffee. Nothing extravagant
TheFactivist
Had to lie and make up an address until I could find an shelter so I could apply for work while I was homeless. I don’t understand why (1/2)
TheFactivist
Do people not understand you need clothes and an address at the very least to apply for work?
L3NTON
And often a phone and e-mail address that you can check/charge regularly.
fartharder
Nothing is more expensive than being poor in the USA
Noodlesocks
I've found that even people with a little money have no concept of how poor some people can be. I've had people assume my parents were...
Noodlesocks
straight up bad parents with the things I've told them we had to do when I was younger.
tonchandailvert
I am sorry.
turbotricycle
My mom watches our toddler. Without her, the childcare would be about $50 less than what my wife makes alone.
Problemwoodchuck
Yup. My old boss expected minimum wage employees to adhere to a business formal dress code after it had been casual for years.
tonchandailvert
Same here! My boss mocked some employees for how they dressed, when they live paycheck to paycheck.
bizzybanana
“The average annual rate for car insurance in Michigan in 2019 was $3,096” ppl can’t afford to drive to work.
bizzybanana
https://m.metrotimes.com/news-hits/archives/2020/01/15/detroit-and-michigan-lead-the-nation-with-the-highest-auto-insurance-rates
captinjojo2000
Boots, ppe, and often tools. Shits expensive yo
Mithi
Which is why in civilised countries work clothes and PPE are to be provided by the employer. Tools obviously also.
L3NTON
I was allowed one pair of boots at cost per year when I worked at Walmart. The shared safety vest had about 10 years of BO on it.
zDealT
A great book about this is written by a social worker who got low wage jobs and lived off the earnings. It's called "Nickled and Dimed".
MarsIsAfire
It's very expensive being poor.
kojenk
Those jobs in the US where they dont confirm the shifts with you, pay shit and have exclusivity contracts so you cant work elsewhere anyway
Pattosaurus20xx
Mariano's is a great example. They expect employees to dress formal:black pants, buttoned down shirt, tie, dress shoes, now put a chef coat
Pattosaurus20xx
and an apron on and stand at a grill and oven and sandwich station at the same time while you cook alive and die on the inside of your own
Pattosaurus20xx
pocket because they will charge you for any part of that 'uniform' you can't find at a goodwill to wear to the shitshow.
Pattosaurus20xx
There was a december where they flat out couldn't keep their payroll records and I went through Christmas without pay.
Pattosaurus20xx
When Mariano's opens a new store they start drawing fulltime employees there to keep it staffed. They rent out a lot a few miles from the
Pattosaurus20xx
location, hire a fucking shuttle bus, and ship you there like you're a fucking catering service. And if you miss that shit bus home you're
Shaodyn
If people are starving to death in the streets and dying from lack of access to basic medical care, a country is having problems.
Shaodyn
And it needs to stop telling everyone it's the greatest country in the world.
thevortexmaster
I assume you're referring to the USA. In Canada I hire people from social rehabilitation services for people with disabilities or have>>>>
thevortexmaster
Trouble finding work based on certain parameters. I can't pay them extremely well as were non profit charity but it's a good stepping stone>
thevortexmaster
And I help as much as I can for them to transition if they desire to
SociallyAwkwardCanadianMoose
Where are you?
thevortexmaster
Nanaimo BC
PizzaStation
There was a point where my wife almost stopped working because her entire check went to childcare. Working to break even. Fortunately /1
GoddammitMrNoodle
That happened to me. Ran out of vacation time because you can't have sick kids in daycare, but still have to pay the full shot.
PizzaStation
We made it work because she has been promoted several times since then, but it was a hard year. /2
astrangehop
Good for you. But that's extra harsh. You lose that time with your child for no real gain :/
PizzaStation
It was brutal, especially for my wife knowing she was working simply to pay for someone else to watch out kids. In the end it was worth /1
PizzaStation
It. She makes good money and works from home now, so it's almost like paying her back for how difficult that year was. /2
madebyjon
We went through something similar several years ago. She stuck it out and the experience was key to her being in the position she's in now.
cattywumpus
My uncle said something like that. Commute on public transpo from poor neighborhoods to new FedEx facility is 2+ hours each way.
josephandrachel2
Years ago I was offered a job at a downtown main branch at a bank for $5 per hour. Minimum wage was $4.25 then. Had to turn it down.
BrawlX1
You can literally fail to get a job if you’re wearing boots they don’t like
prfesser
"Well, just stop being poor" -- Ultrarich and Repubs
lcranston1930
Also Paris Hilton.
DukeDarkwood
She's under "ultrarich"; she was a hotelier heiress before she started selling her look.
prfesser
And her video of a blowjob.
PorneliusHubertII
I have always believed that a society is responsible for helping those that are falling behind. Idk why that is a hard concept to grasp.
GoddammitMrNoodle
They also don't talk about how being poor affects your thinking for years to come. Once you're homeless or at risk of losing your home,
GoddammitMrNoodle
your thinking shifts and you "think poor"... even if you end up becoming more financially stable. It's like poor PTSD.
skincancerisfun
Too right. I see the boots thing brought up alot, but to me this is the real killer. Humans adapt to their circumstances. 100's, 1000's
skincancerisfun
of little thought patterns optimized for surviving while poor, that will work against you as your life improves. It's awful scary throwing
skincancerisfun
away the things that kept you alive, and takes a lot of time and pain and energy.
TheLastSpaceman
I don't understand why redact poster handles. These are statements made publicly, they intended ppl to read them and know who posted them.
DukeDarkwood
And it's not just Reddit's rules, but ours as well: Rule 6. https://imgur.com/rules
DmNerd
People redact to avoid Reddit’s rules on doxing people. I assume a lot of screenshots come from there or are being used there.
Enginerrrrrrrrr
Shit its more than that. Phone, permanent address. Just the ability to be mobile and get to work. Theres like a fixed level you need.
astrangehop
Outside the city: a car. Registered, inspected, and gassed up. A great job 5 miles away is like a 2 hour commute otherwise.
Ueeeeeediot
Spouse & myself are city/county public employees -we cant even afford to live in the same city as we work to serve the community its unreal.
wholady
Not to mention the jobs that check your credit rating.....
LicensedAdHominem
That sounds like it should be super illegal.
activeracer28
That's how walmart can stay so profitable and the customers struggle forever.
onychoprion
Walmart pays so little, workers on welfare, and they can only afford to shop at Walmart.
mickison
it seems a large part of our economy is built and buying throwaway goods over and over.
astrangehop
It's weird layers of useless service. We found out that if you aren't shuffling paper for 60 hours, ya don't need a teen dbag to make coffee
SacrificialClam
Monthly rent at 1,300 is easier for poor people than saving up 15,000 for a down payment on a house with $650 mortgage.
GoGoGadgetBinoculars
$640 mortgage? ok we aren't in the mid 1900s
Cheomesh
Mine's only about $550.
CeruleanK
And then the bank can just take the house away whenever they want. Even if it's paid for. Even if there was never a mortgage with that bank.
Cheomesh
Pretty sure you need way more than 15k for most places in the US that aren't in a rural zone.
DizzyPop
Good luck finding anywhere with a $650 mortgage these days. IF assuming you can get financing. Even then, good luck against all cash offers.
SacrificialClam
I've never owned a house so I have literally zero idea about how much these things cost.
Hyero
Say you buy a house with 0% interest rate and no downpayment for 150k with a 15 year payoff plan. 150k/15 = 10k per year. 10k/12 is 833/mo.
Hyero
Of course this is super simplified, but it's just to make an example.
Cheomesh
Mine is $550 or such about. Old townhouse in an area with a poor reputation though.
JeremyPeevin
1/2 My brother made the same observation about dishtowels. Rich people can afford dishtowels, and have a washing machine to wash them when
JeremyPeevin
2/2 they get dirty. Poor people use paper towels, spending hundreds more in the length of time because they live in an apartment and can't
JeremyPeevin
3/3 just throw a dishtowel in the wash when it gets dirty.
L3NTON
On site laundry is a huge advantage most people don't consider either. Wasting hours of your week waiting for a load of clothes to finish.
zazizuzezo
a dish rack is cheaper than paper towels. dish towel is $1 at dollar tree.
GoGoGadgetBinoculars
thanks boomer
JeremyPeevin
I'm talking about cleaning up spills and messes not dishes.
maiknight98895
I just interviewed a guy the other day only has 9am to 2pm available or overnight because single dad. Couldn't hire don't have a position
pwag
You mean wouldn't.
AccountCreatedToUpvoteDogs
My wife's fox News watching uncle: "nobody told them to have kids" and I said "yes you did with your pro-life fake bullshit"
Sandyundertones
Right because no one ever has their spouse die
AccountCreatedToUpvoteDogs
Yup, but that doesn't compute to the narrow minded like this uncle.
EndorForestSummerCamp83
As a single Dad whos stuck in my current job because no new job can accommodate my parenting schedule, and I wouldn't be eligible for FMLA
AccountCreatedToUpvoteDogs
You're sacrificing for your kid (choosing security) and that's admirable.
EndorForestSummerCamp83
Until I'd been at the new job for a year, I felt this in my soul.
MrTruTru
No government grants? Here business get paid to hire and train people through apprenticeships and what not
AccountCreatedToUpvoteDogs
That's awesome. Internships here are usually limited to those in university and are often unpaid (earning college credit instead).
MrTruTru
Any mature age apprenticeships or anything like that ?
xyxyxyxy31
maiknight98895
To accommodate those hours to justify the training expense and risk when there are so many other applicants to consider.
CloakerJosh
It's rough for some, right? Really limits their opportunities, not having means.
DonnaNobleInTheLibrary
Would the position allow remote work? Like, he could come in in the mornings and afternoons work from home.
GoGoGadgetBinoculars
obviously not
DonnaNobleInTheLibrary
Not necessarily obvious. Some do, but nobody thought about it or management doesn't want it.
maiknight98895
Yeah unfortunately it is a general labor position.
Cryolith
ThePretentiousGentleman
There’s like maybe 2 examples of actual rags and then to riches I can think of, and that’s Oprah and J.K. Rowling, and I’m barely sure of JK
DoughnutJimmy
JK was on the "dole" the UK equivalant of welfare.
ThePretentiousGentleman
I think that counts as rags. Wasn’t she homeless for a bit too?
skellington01
It’s far from being improbable in most countries, the US is the only free country that actively works to prevent it from happening.
Sage042000
I grew up poor, (or if not, I wasn't far from it). Couldn't afford college. Make a decent wage now after plenty job hopping. Was thinking
Sage042000
/2 after hearing how desperate they are for truck drivers that I should be able to do that and earn a great wage. $5700 for school.
Sage042000
/3 Gotta be damn near homeless or fresh outta jail to qualify for state help.
u3prdg5gky6
I had to stop myself from working over 35 hours each week so I was under the salary requirement and could get subsidized childcare.
u3prdg5gky6
I had to dock my pay $100 each week to get $300 in childcare
18Litre
Yep, even Bezos had his parents to give him the initial $100,000 to help him start. Mommy and daddy helped.
angelghoul
i dont have parents, grandparents, or godparents. i’m only 25. shits mentally and financially hard without a good support system.
18Litre
Sorry, my man. That's tough. Good luck to you on your life struggles.
angelghoul
thanks bud - i haven’t given up yet! but i just wanted to point out that some people start off with less/more than others.
Lodrial
What, you mean YOU didn't get the typical $100 000 gift from your parents? Ha. Loser. /s
BrazilianThunderPanda
PLUS the $245,573 to stop Amazon from failing in 1995.
DarthGoodguy
Was going to say that. It’s always the way.
eratoanothea
And Dolly Parton has Jolene.
64645
All my homies hate Jolene.
eratoanothea
They aren't into Scottish or Irish ladies, aye?
[deleted]
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vegivamp
You can't afford gas to drive to your job. What do you do?
pwag
I spent 5 hours, on my day off, pulling used parts off a 36 year old car in a junk yard, so I could keep my 31 year old car on thr road...
pwag
I'm not the guy to pose this question to. The only time this happened, I walked across town (a few miles) to work.
pwag
My keyboard is not doing me any favors. Sorry about the typos.
Cryolith
In the US you practically do. We have the lowest economic mobility metrics of "first world" countries.
darkdragonempress
But having family support is one of the biggest indicators of success. Social mobility has been tanking for decades and it’s a big problem.
pwag
Define family suport?
darkdragonempress
Money. Access to resources. The person living in the richer area is almost always going to have better schools.
[deleted]
[deleted]
ThePretentiousGentleman
Some people do.
pwag
Some people expect to go from rags to riches. They should be pushing to go from rags to thrift store clothes while setting their progeny...
pwag
Up to successfully make the steps up...
ThePretentiousGentleman
And some people are moving mountains and still can’t afford to get out of poverty. I know. I’m friends with homeless people.
[deleted]
[deleted]
CorvidPrime
I used to work retail, and that boot thing is ABSOLUTELY true. It happened time and time again. But some people just can’t afford good boots
CptKoolaid
I prefer my $40 boots over my $200 boots. When they get beat up and covered in grime I can just replace them frequently.
vegivamp
Nothing works if you don't take care of your stuff.
thedudeman519
"The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten"
Jokke1995
"If you buy cheap tools, you'll cry every time you use it. If you buy high quality tools, you only cry once".
CaptainYesterday
Worked retail. Got wrote up after the bleach stained my black pants. Said I was out of uniform, when it happened that day. I quit. Fuck em.
sudoalias404
Living nomad life now, just bought cheap Chinese shoes for like $12. 3 months later, they are broken and terrible. My previous shoes were >
sudoalias404
> Ghost Brooks 10's. Lasted me for 4+ years. Comfortable and solid the whole time. Paid maybe $120 for them.
TheDairyPope
The math checks out. $12*4pairs per year*4 years = $192, and at the end you've spent an extra $72 and still need shoes.
ThisGuyPostingThings
It reminds me of car ownership. I was lucky to inherit a fairly well-maintained but rather unused car. When it was totalled (truck hit 1/3
ThisGuyPostingThings
it while it was parked), I ended up financing a new vehicle. Spent a decent amount of $ over the years, but it was low end w/ $ down 2/3
ThisGuyPostingThings
and it still runs well <12 years later. My brother, meanwhile, has had several used vehicles and had to spend a lot in repairs. 3/3
ThisGuyPostingThings
Yes, I was very lucky to have a steady job that paid well enough to do that, but I am so glad I made the choice I did when I could.
Bristlecone42
Same thing with the nonprofit I work for. We want to buy good equipment, but we can only afford the cheapest stuff, which we have to replace
CuileannDhu
It's true of almost every consumer good. Capitalism exploits the poor on almost every front.
BlinkSpunk
Payless was the choice until it went out of business
MissingCog
My boss gives us 50 towards good boots because how damaging our environment is lol if we had cheap boots they would last a week
PectorialMuscles
I'd have spent many hundreds on boots by now if I wasn't wearing the same pair I got 4-5 years ago.
jgtriple642
There are programs in Canada to get donated suits for jobs.
whodathunkit
I saved hard to buy a pair of good shoes, cost me $150, lasted me 10 years before they finally were unwearable, worth every cent.
mynameisnotFREDmymomjustcallsmethat
I've had to ductape my "dress" sandals (not flipflops) because they broke while I was teaching. Then has to save for new ones
FartmanMD
I only recently became able to buy good work shoes. Before that I had to buy 15 bucks shoes every other month. Haven’t had to replace
FartmanMD
Then since I bought them and they’re super durable. Man it feels so good
Phake
Good pair of boots will coat ya at least 60. For me thats 3 weeks of food.
LadyLink
I spent over 200 dollars on shoes for my toe tapping ASD child who kept tearing apart shoes. I only managed because I found some 1/2
LadyLink
Connies for 20 bucks on a second hand site. I would have managed eventually but it would have been $70 bucks for them new
PrincessOctopus
I've been looking at good sneakers since I'm likely to be on my feet all day and the good pairs that last and actually help are like 100 1
PrincessOctopus
Bucks where as I can go to Walmart and get a cheap pair of sneakers and insoles for like 30 and they will only last me a couple months.
AtmaDarkwolf
Can attest to this. When I worked construction, I would buy the cheapest I could afford, till the day I 'found' a pair of 300dollar boots.
AtmaDarkwolf
them boots are still trucking now, over 20 years(10years after accident) and are still(other then scuffed) my daily 'shoes'
AtmaDarkwolf
(and by found, yes, I admit, I nicked them cuz were exactly my size and someone left them behind)
ChukclesNuts
A true employer reimburses your work boots and etc.
kimmie71490
Yeah, when I was really really poor…I was buying my kids $10 shoes for school. It seemed like I was constantly having to buy them new ones
kimmie71490
Not because they outgrew the shoes, but because they would break easily after awhile. Eventually, got to the point where I could afford
kimmie71490
Better quality shoes for them and it lasts a school year.
captinjojo2000
Cheap boots are more expensive then expensive ones. Cheap ones have to be replaced far more often and usually cause discomfort.
ligmabolz
Idk . I got me some Walmart boots 2 years ago. Still kicking and they're the most comfortable boots I've ever owned.
CorvidPrime
Yes, that was the story and my point. But when a customer comes in with $50 and needs boots NOW, they can’t buy the $100 boots.
mksu
Doesn't matter if you only have $10 in your pocket and need new boots today.
pwag
Did you read the post...
captinjojo2000
Dl;dr
eftwyrd
Than*
NoGynocologist
Are we just repeating the post in the comments?
pwag
Yes. People are stupid
captinjojo2000
Yeah. ?
Magjee
Expanding a little, they added in health troubles from poor shoes :(
PropainAndPropainAccesories
Are just repeating the comments in the comments?
IAmACyberneticOrganismLivingTissueOverEndoskeleton
Maybe if you had proper labor laws that wouldnt happen, I never payed for a pair of boots, its always the employers resp. to pay for that
ReturnoftheZombiePlagueApocalypse
...and, you do realise....it is also a metaphor for other aspects of life.....? not just......boots?
Fishkeeper
What if someone doesn't have a job that requires good boots? Or a job, period?
IAmACyberneticOrganismLivingTissueOverEndoskeleton
When you get hired they have to give you money for a pair of boots, where I work they replace our boots/shoes once a year.
derzilly
Reread the question.
Fishkeeper
I mean, that's great, but do all jobs do that? What if someone has a sitting job, but has to walk home? And, again, what about jobless ppl?
IAmACyberneticOrganismLivingTissueOverEndoskeleton
Why would someone working at a desk need security boots? And yes I dont expect the company I work for to pay for my shoes.
IAmACyberneticOrganismLivingTissueOverEndoskeleton
When I say they pay for boots/shoes I mean steel toe boots/shoes, if a job requires security gear the employers has to pay for it.
somebodythatyouusetoknow
And they become conditioned to think the expensive one will wear out in the same amount of time. I grew up poor but clawed my way out. I ->
dailysuicidalthoughts
I've bought $200 steel toes, $400 steel toes, and $70 steel toes, each pair, just over a year of use, but the tire center destroys footwear.
illogicalphallusies
thats because the half the time...they will. $20 Levi jeans and $100 Versache jeans are the same
Foxsayy
As someone trying to make it, another issue is what's actually quality vs what's expensive and is just going to wear out. I have no idea
SpoilsburyToastMan
If it's a fashionable brand name, it's generally cheap shite with an expensive name tag.
someguy7734206
There are definitely plenty of cases where you are paying more for the brand or fancy unnecessary features. After all, a Toyota is much…
someguy7734206
… more reliable than a BMW.
vegivamp
Reviews on the internet. From multiple sites, and always check the low ratings for recurring complaints.
Foxsayy
Yeah but sometimes you don't even know what to look for. A shoehorn? Edmond Allen's? Cedar shapers? All relevant to keep high quality shoes
somebodythatyouusetoknow
Have had arguments with my parents about spending more for better quality. They feel I'm wasting money. I bought my mom some good running ->
IPoopOnCompanyTime
"If it separates you from the ground, it's worth spending good money on" is some of the best advice I've ever gotten
Allusernamesweretaken
Tires, shoes and sheets i heard.
vegivamp
Mattress, more likely. If the mattress is good, your sleep will be better.
somebodythatyouusetoknow
Shoes a few years back and she just said the other days she's surprised they still feel so good. It really sucks.
engineeringwombocombo
My parents also bought into that mentality. And yet they're the ones that taught me "you get what you pay for".
SerialChickenLover
Buy everything Patagonia. They’ll repair anything they’ve made, even a ski jacket from the 70s that hey haven’t produced in decades.
katychla
Running shoes were what surprised me too. It's a really hard mindset to get out of.
UselessFacts
All the "Dollar" stores exploit this mentality
somebodythatyouusetoknow
Omg yes. The number of times my parents tell me "you can get that from the dollar store for cheaper..." is too damn high.