I've been making this argument since 2010 and am yet to see a counter to it. This and the fact that we can't force people to donate organs even if it means saving a life in the name of bodily autonomy which is the most basic natural right of a person.
So ... you're telling me the Biblical view is that the fetus is the father's property? And an abortion without his consent is destruction ofn property and illegal? What kind of bullshit is that? Also I don't think these people care too much about the literal Bible texts - they'll cherrypick whatever fits their agenda.
Women were considered property of their husbands back in this time, as were any children. When looking at things like this you need to divorce yourself to a degree from modern thinking to understand how they understood things in that era. That's a big part of her video lessons on things, it's a skill to be developed. You don't have to accept it as doctrine, just understand why it says what it says, and where it came from.
To me, the biggest idiot isn't the right wing nut job who is "pro life" or loves Trump or whatever. To me, the biggest idiots, bordering insanity, are the people who still think they can argue with logic, evidence, or facts and convince people who aren't even convinced of what they say, but rather use religion or whatever as a convenient tool for control, vanity, greed, and oppression.
A lovely, educational and respectful view of the abortion topic. Of which a Christian is likely to reply: Nah.
They can't just give up their worldview, even if it is wrong. It's part of who they are and the actions they've taken which must be righteous because the pastor said they were.
The problem is the majority of them wouldn't have even given her the time to listen to her argument at all. So it doesn't really matter if they could understand it, they are choosing not to hear it in the first place.
I think the stupidity is actually the cause, not the result. I don't think people are born evil. They learn it. The stupid people eventually become the evil people. That is obvious.
I wonder what it would be like if this woman and Katy Porter were to show up at any congressional hearing and were allowed to pick apart every BS argument they have pertaining to religion and politics.
What's the point of justifying anything with the Bible? And if you do, does that mean you find acceptable to consider that everything in it is some kind of valuable truth? If you need to refer to a book written by bronze age people thousands of years ago (that, to me, has no more value than any other book of the kind) to make choices about today's life, to define your moral compass, or to impose your opinion on other people's life, whatever comes out of your mouth has absolutely zero value.
A Catholic priest, a Methodist pastor, and a Rabbi are having a discussion about abortion and when life begins. The priest says "Life begins at the moment of conception." The pastor says "I disagree. Life begins when the fetus has fully formed at around the third trimester. " Then the rabbi says "No you're both wrong. Life begins when the kid turns 18 when you kick him out and say 'Take the dog with you'."
She is incredibly well versed in doctrine of all kinds. She destroys the Christian nationalists with notes taken directly from their *source* all the time and it's a thing of beauty. Follow her, you won't regret (I don't do tiktok but she is on IG)
I would really like to see this woman and Katy Porter with her white board, form a partnership where they show up at government hearings and just slaughter all these ingnorant talking heads with facts and diagrams that pick apart every BS premise they have with regards to religion and politics.
Interesting analysis. But I generally don't care about the "rules" and "interpretations" from books of religious fundamentalists. Her body, her choice!
The ten commandments are in the old testament, yes. But not only the old testament. 9 are repeated in the new testament as moral guidelines for believers, excluding the commandment to keep the Sabbath.
Again, you know less about this stuff than you think.
Yes, they are repeated because as Jesus says they aren't to do away with the old word and it has not been changed. The distinction usually made between moral and ceremonial laws. This is because the obligations of ceremonial laws has been fulfilled while the moral precepts are still mandated as an act of love to God.
I studied this stuff for a good portion of my life. I know quite a bit more about this than you're assuming.
Pretty sure abortion is in fact in the Bible. Can't remember the passage but new testament I'm sure. Look between the incest, the plagues, the weird animal shit, it was the least interesting part I read
The Exodus scripture she starts off with right from the start is a scenario where a pregnant woman is accidentally injured. She didn't choose it, which usually the argument.
Adam living at first breathes...ok, but he wasn't a baby in a womb.
Lots of scripture that values life before birth: Psalm 139:13 (knit me in your mother's womb); Jeremiah 1:5 (before formed in your mother's womb, I knew you); Luke 1:44
I mean, I don't give a shit, do what you need to do, but this person is misleading.
Don't be such a doomer. This kinda post aren't for the people they're arguing with, its for the people watching the conversation from the sidelines. There are people who despite being raised in the horseshit are honest, curious, and willing to learn. I was one of them. I was raised in a very conservative evangelical tradition. I ain't any of that.
Sadly, those that most need to hear this shit go glass-eyed and start hearing internal looping circus music after about 5 seconds into the video. So... ya. Love them too, but the people that MOST need the education have some superpower that prevents them from ever learning.
I would argue that those who most need are the young people who still have a more flexible mind. The kids who are raised in this bullshit but are asking questions. You likely won't change their parents' opinions, but you can help them form their own.
tolgabrotha
I've been making this argument since 2010 and am yet to see a counter to it. This and the fact that we can't force people to donate organs even if it means saving a life in the name of bodily autonomy which is the most basic natural right of a person.
MikeRInternetTraveler
The Bible also considers rape to be a property crime.
The victim? The woman’s father or husband.
The punishment? If the woman is unmarried, the rapist must give silver to her father, and then marry her.
It’s fucking horrific.
Starfox5
Why the fuck should anyone sane care what a book that condones slavery says about abortion?
AvidApostate
Monte is great. I love listening to her.
Poppypoppoppop
You don't get to justify it. Period. Not your body, not your choice. F OFF.
KPodol
Yup, arguing over the bible actually only serves to legitimize it as a way to dictate rules over people's lives.
sorrythatisunavailable
you'll never convince them because they're just a bunch of hypocrites that are full of hate
PunnyTiger
if they could be convinced by fact, data or logic then they wouldn't be trump loving, woman hating, dirtbag hypocrites
beachbum273
I'm getting MAJOR Pauley Perrette vibes and I'm 1000% here for it.
Imadethisaccounttopost
Doesn't Numbers 5:11-31 actually give directions on how to induce an abortion?
HollerinAtTheVoid
You’d be surprised how many of them lose you at “reading the bible”. They have it read to them and they like it that way and brag about it
017renegade
So ... you're telling me the Biblical view is that the fetus is the father's property? And an abortion without his consent is destruction ofn property and illegal? What kind of bullshit is that?
Also I don't think these people care too much about the literal Bible texts - they'll cherrypick whatever fits their agenda.
nutmegonyourdoodle
It’s the fact that the woman is also a husband’s property that sets this.
IncognitoEnthusiast
Women were considered property of their husbands back in this time, as were any children. When looking at things like this you need to divorce yourself to a degree from modern thinking to understand how they understood things in that era. That's a big part of her video lessons on things, it's a skill to be developed. You don't have to accept it as doctrine, just understand why it says what it says, and where it came from.
0penname
She reminds me of Xena
ArdentNature
To me, the biggest idiot isn't the right wing nut job who is "pro life" or loves Trump or whatever.
To me, the biggest idiots, bordering insanity, are the people who still think they can argue with logic, evidence, or facts and convince people who aren't even convinced of what they say, but rather use religion or whatever as a convenient tool for control, vanity, greed, and oppression.
Photeus
A lovely, educational and respectful view of the abortion topic.
Of which a Christian is likely to reply: Nah.
They can't just give up their worldview, even if it is wrong. It's part of who they are and the actions they've taken which must be righteous because the pastor said they were.
TotallyNotASerialKiller
You could totally own the MAGA’s with this… if they were smart enough to understand it. The < 5% that are don’t care and just want to control women.
Targe0
The problem is the majority of them wouldn't have even given her the time to listen to her argument at all.
So it doesn't really matter if they could understand it, they are choosing not to hear it in the first place.
werrywerry
I think the stupidity is actually the cause, not the result.
I don't think people are born evil. They learn it.
The stupid people eventually become the evil people. That is obvious.
StellarJay77
I wonder what it would be like if this woman and Katy Porter were to show up at any congressional hearing and were allowed to pick apart every BS argument they have pertaining to religion and politics.
gHoStBuStEr3456
Well it’s a good thing I ain’t Christian ( I haven’t watched the video yet, just responding to that persons text)
Balluduku
What's the point of justifying anything with the Bible? And if you do, does that mean you find acceptable to consider that everything in it is some kind of valuable truth?
If you need to refer to a book written by bronze age people thousands of years ago (that, to me, has no more value than any other book of the kind) to make choices about today's life, to define your moral compass, or to impose your opinion on other people's life, whatever comes out of your mouth has absolutely zero value.
bigboneded
Go tell it on the mountain!
Imapseudonym
A Catholic priest, a Methodist pastor, and a Rabbi are having a discussion about abortion and when life begins. The priest says "Life begins at the moment of conception." The pastor says "I disagree. Life begins when the fetus has fully formed at around the third trimester. " Then the rabbi says "No you're both wrong. Life begins when the kid turns 18 when you kick him out and say 'Take the dog with you'."
erinaceus
shes right, but theres no point in preaching to the choir. the antiabortion people wont listen to this.
Autittuderp
She is incredibly well versed in doctrine of all kinds. She destroys the Christian nationalists with notes taken directly from their *source* all the time and it's a thing of beauty.
Follow her, you won't regret (I don't do tiktok but she is on IG)
StellarJay77
I would really like to see this woman and Katy Porter with her white board, form a partnership where they show up at government hearings and just slaughter all these ingnorant talking heads with facts and diagrams that pick apart every BS premise they have with regards to religion and politics.
Autittuderp
I'd pay to see that
StellarJay77
Right?! Put it in an octagon and it could go on UFC pay-per-view.
gandraw
You know what Christians do with women who know the bible well? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anne_Askew
SchmuseTigger
She is also drop dead gorgeous
Eldis
Monte Mader is also on Youtube, so need for IG or Tiktok to follow her stuff.
stronomer
Interesting analysis. But I generally don't care about the "rules" and "interpretations" from books of religious fundamentalists. Her body, her choice!
killer10347
Christians don't adhere to the old testament anymore but you wouldn't know that because you know almost nothing of Christianity
MasterBountakun
Then the commandments are moot, as are various other rules like the supposed one about homosexuality.
Futher Jesus expressly says he didn't come to do away with the old law nor change it.
Evangelicals in particular just don't really adhere to anything unless it personally suits them.
killer10347
The ten commandments are in the old testament, yes. But not only the old testament. 9 are repeated in the new testament as moral guidelines for believers, excluding the commandment to keep the Sabbath.
Again, you know less about this stuff than you think.
MasterBountakun
Yes, they are repeated because as Jesus says they aren't to do away with the old word and it has not been changed. The distinction usually made between moral and ceremonial laws. This is because the obligations of ceremonial laws has been fulfilled while the moral precepts are still mandated as an act of love to God.
I studied this stuff for a good portion of my life. I know quite a bit more about this than you're assuming.
Lammergeier350
They don't adhere to the New Testament, either, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
IamMadeOfShamrocks
Phew! A Catholic that always supported people's right to have an abortion, this makes me feel a whole lot better about it!
zylokun
Pretty sure abortion is in fact in the Bible. Can't remember the passage but new testament I'm sure. Look between the incest, the plagues, the weird animal shit, it was the least interesting part I read
beleaves
Memed it for ya
/gallery/FWhzWjX#KHHrLxv
mmmerf1
I would be honestly interested to hear her response to Jeremiah 1 (don't know the exact verse) "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you."
Not saying she's wrong, I think she knows her stuff and it's easy to see that she's on the side of the angels. I just want to know what she'd say.
StonesTwice
well said, but you'll never change the small minds that think their point of view is the only one
jbrightmans
The Exodus scripture she starts off with right from the start is a scenario where a pregnant woman is accidentally injured. She didn't choose it, which usually the argument.
Adam living at first breathes...ok, but he wasn't a baby in a womb.
Lots of scripture that values life before birth: Psalm 139:13 (knit me in your mother's womb); Jeremiah 1:5 (before formed in your mother's womb, I knew you); Luke 1:44
I mean, I don't give a shit, do what you need to do, but this person is misleading.
abidikgubidik
yup, thanks for the facts, but they mean less than nothing to MAGA and the evangelicals
Burke616
You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into.
SilentScreamsX
I've seen replies on a few of her posts. Apparently having a nose ring makes everything she says invalid according to the MAGA crowd.
mafiacarstarter
The bible says whatever they are told the the bible says.
MrImmaculate
Don't be such a doomer. This kinda post aren't for the people they're arguing with, its for the people watching the conversation from the sidelines. There are people who despite being raised in the horseshit are honest, curious, and willing to learn. I was one of them. I was raised in a very conservative evangelical tradition. I ain't any of that.
StonesTwice
It's nice to there are critical thinkers out there.
MyCommentsUsuallyHaveTypos
Those are the kind of people who think roads were built just for them.
Toqom
The ones who push the Bible as reason don't believe in it at all, it's just their excuse
afatality
and those small minds will be ignored and forgotten eventually
werrywerry
As will all minds, eventually.
But this week they rule over all of us.
Baelfyr3
I love videos like these. Spit facts girl.
Niagaran
So good OP submitted it twice
AtmaDarkwolf
Sadly, those that most need to hear this shit go glass-eyed and start hearing internal looping circus music after about 5 seconds into the video. So... ya. Love them too, but the people that MOST need the education have some superpower that prevents them from ever learning.
textilelover
I would argue that those who most need are the young people who still have a more flexible mind. The kids who are raised in this bullshit but are asking questions. You likely won't change their parents' opinions, but you can help them form their own.
mmotky
Right!?!, I learned the shit out of something. I had no idea that abortion wasn't a Christian based moral.
Baelfyr3
Look into circumsicion
RuffyRuffHausen
If only they'd care about facts
hwatL4bloopy
Plus a woman said it so it's just her opinion
nutmegonyourdoodle
-sigh-