CrimsonPermanentAssurance
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Feb 2, 2026 7:32 AM
CrimsonPermanentAssurance
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TrumpRapesAndEatsChildren0002
What a load of BS from some holier-than-thou moron who doesn't understand tactics or the voting system the US is riddled with.
BigDaddysMeatWagon
"vote blue but definitely vote in the primaries for the Democrat who is most left but certainly never vote for a Republican" is my strategy
ButtscratchMcPherson
Right. So in the general election, if we're presented with a non-pure Dem and a maga Republican, we should just not vote and let the maga win. Because that's just a brilliant ****ing strategy right there. Show up for primaries, get the better person to win there, but letting maga win the general is LITERALLY THE FUCKING IDIOCY that got Trump in the White House to start with in 2016 and 2024. For fuck['s sake.
khety1890
This is the same "this candidate isn't pure enough"-idea which got you US-americans Trump. Twice, I might add. There won't be any pressure on candidates to work for you if you never vote for them because they aren't pure enough.
ABn0rmal1
Learn how primaries work and VOTE in the primaries.
lozeldatkm
Hey, OP:
Nightchime
Supporting third party, at the local level where there's a chance, might be pretty healthy.
PanNonOpticon
Vote blue no matter what, and you can shift the party to left. The shifting happens in the primaries, you nutjob.
Look at the republicans. The right most politicians come from districts that are sure wins for Republicans. That is because they don't have to cater the left leaning Republicans.
tidepool
THEN VOTE IN YOUR PRIMARIES!!! This is so important!!! If you’re sick of the Dems you have, find out who is running that is what you want and campaign for them in the primaries! Encourage Dems to go vote in the primaries! You can’t whine about who you have to vote for later if you TRIED for better candidates. Mamdani wasn’t a fluke, people VOTED FOR HIM!!
tidepool
I’m only yelling because the turn outs for primaries are dismal and the democrats turn out for midterms are worse than dismal most of the time. Who always shows up? Republicans! Get off your asses and make a change!!
sowhat4
Here in NC, candidates for office are not disclosing that they are Republicans. You have to go online and read about their positions and who contributes to them (AKA owns them) before you vote. The key words I look for are patriot, god fearing, law and order to tell me they are fascists.
thewhereiankelly
Vote in the primary GOD DAMN!!! Then if your preferred candidate loses don’t punish us with Trump by not voting for Hillary. IT ISNT THAT HARD. I swear the don’t vote people are a Psy op
Quixus
That's what primaries are for. Make sure no DINOS are on the ballot.
SisyphusRollin
Outside of brain damage folks or outright scammers there is no DINO, thats a horrible phrase to co-opt from the right. Not everyone has the exact same beliefs, the left is now everyone who isn't in MAGA which includes people who don't agree. Just because a candidate isn't 100% on what you believe doesn't mean they don't stand for what many others on the left do. DINO is just a way to ruin a party, turn it cultish.
anononanonanona
Anyone who says shit like this doesn’t know what a primary is and probably doesn’t even actually vote at all
worldrecordstudios
The stuff wasn't happening under Obama or Biden and wouldn't have happened under Kamala
mardukkur
These people are too stupid to breathe without assistance.
If you don't "vote blue no matter who" what you do is elect Republicans.
If you don't want to see the Democratic party move right, you vote in every primary and every election.
StephenDaniels
I guess OP was hoping nobody would actually look at what Murphy pocket vetoed. The facts are that one of the bills contained a typo that completely changed what the law would require and it was too late to just edit it and re-pass it. The next governor will sign the corrected version in a little while. The other one goes further than what's being done unofficially now, which is that the police don't help ICE. He was perfectly ok with making that the law instead of an informal practice.
mardukkur
OP is a straight up pro-maga disinformation account.
eronth
Where exactly do you see that?
wandermanspacebot
"Both sides" is the most intellectually vacant opinion on the internet. And it's most frequently pushed by disingenuous conservatives. Downvote and move on if you have a brain.
BarryTheCyborg
THAT'S WHY YOU VOTE IN THE FUCKING PRIMARIES!
haveanupvotegif
Or, hear me out, you take a few minutes to learn about the people on the ballot and then do your best to pick the least awful person on there instead of treating it like a sports team you have to blindly worship
mardukkur
That's how you get vote blue no matter who.
RatsLiveOnNoEvilStar
That's a problem only if you ignore primaries. Vote Blue No Matter Wo is about a Democrat going against a Republican.
Its in the primaries where you decide who best matches your views.
xj4low
My choices here in Texas are pretty limited. If there is a democrat on the ballot, there is usually only one running and my district is gerrymandered to hell. I'm in Denton (North of Dallas) and my House rep territory covers the entire panhandle of Texas. It's a 6+ hr drive from one side to the other.
RatsLiveOnNoEvilStar
By design unfortunatly. :(
You could always try to run yourself? One of the best parts about how our system is designed is that there are few legal bars that keeps a citizen from being a representative on some level.
xj4low
I don't have the inner filter required for public speaking. That and I make people uncomfortable when I'm in the room. I also has too much dirt in my past to make a good candidate. My wife would hate it.
RatsLiveOnNoEvilStar
I hear ya.
UncleMartha
Well, *somebody* decides who to run, then you adjust your views.
Miller16of16
They decide who's going to run, and even who is going to get primaried. The DSA got eviscerated by Zionist candidates.
flail
Present your evidence. Which primary was rigged? What is the proof it was rigged? Which primary did they have super delegates overrule the votes of people?
SisyphusRollin
Look, right wing propaganda.
rdmage11
Ranked choice voting would fix a lot of issues. Until then 3rd party votes in smaller local elections to build support are a great start. This post also ignores the fact that shitty centrist Dems are still a better choice than Republicans.
itsthevoiceman
"Heritage will restore faith in elections and protect the right to vote for all Americans
by advocating for commonsense reforms at the state and federal level like requiring
proof of U.S. citizenship to vote and ending the practice of ranked-choice voting. "
https://www.heritage.org/sites/default/files/2025-03/2025_Priorities.pdf
TheMomaw
And thus why Republicans introduced a bill to ban ranked choice voting.
aflarge
Ranked choice wouldn't fix it, we'd still need actually good candidates to run, but it SURE WOULD HELP if we ever finally got one.
RatsLiveOnNoEvilStar
It would help if we removed primaries. If there were 5 democrats running, I would choose the dems that fit my views before the ones that didn't and not vote for the Republicans at all.
Independents would also have a better showing since they could be filtered into the list based on how much I agree with their politics.
BishlamekGurpgork
Invalid premise, I think. The premise assumes there will be a powerful right in power that can pressure democrats even when they can't win the vote in most elections.
If they right cannot gain power by moving right, they must begin to centralize. If the left wants to be more left than a centralizing right, they must move with that window.
SisyphusRollin
Kinda like a Neoliberal old as shit Catholic working with the progressive party during his Presidency and passing the most progressive platform in most of our lives, you know, Biden.
BishlamekGurpgork
I don't see how that relates. Biden's term of power did not exist in those circumstances.
SisyphusRollin
What... term of power? He ran on and specifically worked with and passed progressive legislation under an insane house. The point is that supporting neoliberals, in specific places like the General election or say Arizona, is how we get progressive policies right now. We just lived through an example of that, just ask Bernie Sanders or AOC.
BishlamekGurpgork
The term . . . that he was in power. The span of time that he was president. He did not exist in a time in which everyone was voting blue no matter what, and the right was being forced to centralize to try and retain a vote.
So, what I suggested would be the case if that happened, did not happen during Biden's term, and that is normal to expect.
SisyphusRollin
What are you on about, it was Bidens presidential run in which that became the rallying cry. That was when this all began, because of the worry of another Trump administration. The right was as worse if not worse than it is now in office, literally heckling instead of governing. That was when it happened, that was the whole origination of this concept and it being spread wide and far.
SisyphusRollin
The right didn't come to the central in his admin, holy shit, we had to split everything right down the middle. This is some historical revisionist bullshit man, this is surreal. Vote blue no matter who was about making sure Trump couldn't get another term, make sure the SCOTUS didn't go further right. Elections happened during his time in office as well, guess what everyone was saying then as well? Maybe vote blue, no that wasn't it.
FetaForMoses
Two party systems kinda suck, huh?
ipointoutnahtzeesbyreplyingtothem
When both are captured by capital and the DNC throw millions of dollars against anyone who runs as a leftist Dem who isn't going to be a corporate stooge? Yes. Can we currently change the entire system of voting in a country of 300 million people to lessen their effect? No. Find a new argument besides whining about "first past the post".
override367
Having more than two parties with FPP means the conservatives always win
PickleRiiiiiiiiiiiiick
What 2 parties? Corporate right and corporate far-right?
jeejeejerrycotton
They are antithetical to democracy as they are de facto a single-party system. I.e. only one party is in power at any given point in time. There is never any need to compromise.
UncleMartha
They represent one of the wings of the only party you're allowed to vote for: The Capitalist Party.
TeamSpicyTacos
A situation requiring no solution isn't a solution to our situation. So we are screwed unless this phase allows anyone to reorganize govt. Which I doubt.
GuysJustWannaFish
Especially since it's actually a one party system
SisyphusRollin
BOTH SIDES!
FreePalestineAndTheWorldFromIsrael
Tell that to some people in Imgur who are sycophants to anything Dems.
shehdbeuebw738373
It's pretty simple.
Put a referendum to change to STV or ranked choice, I am all for it.
In my votes today, however, I have two choices. I'm sure it's possible for Red to be better than Blue if you have an an actual human running under R, but I'm always picking the best of two, and that has so far been Blue.
I don't have a magical "Get super mad so my vote counts 50x what it normally does and I magic a leftist into office" button.
In our system, primarying is the best option for leftists.
baadf00d
How would you even get rid of it. Civil war?
GravyEducation
No shit Sherlock. And I mean that with respect
Bigblackdick69
Washington warned us about a 2 party system
InTangier
It's not just that. In a multi-party system you kinda have that in practice, tbh. You usually have 2 bigger parties that the smaller ones form coalitions around.
The issue is more that the Dems are controlled right wing opposition. Not right wing enough to dismantle the welfare state, but never allow the party to move even a bit to the left to fix it, let alone reform it. You get half-assed solutions like ACA, which did help, but got you further from universal healthcare, not closer.
SisyphusRollin
"Demes are controlled right wing opposition" is some maga shit.
InTangier
Is it? Did you check who is president, who failed to defeat the worst presidential candidate I've seen from the US, and that's saying a lot. And even now you have the pathetic leadership from the likes of Schumer, and the leftovers from Pelosi.
I'm not from the US, but man, you US liberals are in such an abusive relationship with the Dems you developed some kind of Stockholm Syndrome.
When faced with actual left wingers, even moderate ones like Zohran, they lose their collective shit.
Donfolstar
But in a multi-party system, the parties within the coalitions shift power. Sometimes dramatically. More importantly, the smaller parties exert constant pressure on the larger parties and the national narrative. In the USA with our antiquated form of government, all of that basically falls on Bernie's shoulders, and the man isn't getting younger.
theworldcouldbeflat
The Democrats haven't had full power of the federal government since the 1970's, so it's kind of 1 party.
tidepool
I’m pretty sure Obama had full control for his first two years and that’s how we got the ACA? Or were there actual upstanding Rs at the time?
Clockworkdancerobot
It wasn't two years. we had a few scant months of a fillabuster proof majority, and getting the ACA was like pulling teeth.
theworldcouldbeflat
There was a Government shut down in October to stop the expiration of ACA benefits, the expiration was a Republican amendment that got included in the ACA. If Democrats had had the votes to pass the ACA it wouldn't be expiring.
vanbarbee
Obama didn't have full control of anything outside of the Presidency. Senate supermajority was brief and thanks to right-wing Dems whose blood red states would vote them out within two cycles, same with the House on a much shorter time-frame. Neither body served at his behest. A Dem-appointed majority in the Supreme Court hasn't existed since Nixon. ACA was a compromise of compromises and even that was eaten alive by the right wing media that has dominated the airwaves since the early 90s.
PballQhead
No, you're correct. Not a single R voted for the ACA
Actually, even then it had to be watered down…that scumfuck Lieberman refused to vote for it unless Medicare for All was stripped out.
theworldcouldbeflat
Except the shutdown happened in October because of Republican Amendments. Abstaining was traded for expiration of the ACA. People with full control don't put expirations on the bills they pass.
MySushi
Electoral suckage (college) does not allow an alternative, even if a party unanimously votes to introduce some manner of political reform against their own best interests. These lifelong senators are worse parasites than many billionaires
BilltheCatisBack
EC has no effect on the election of senators and representatives . Why aren’t 3rd party people building bases there.
Unclescam
I might be wrong here but it didn't completely suck at first. States electors didn't go all in at first but they divided their votes proportionally. Now, whether the system was designed with the intent that someone would do that obvious thing a break it, well I wasn't there.
tidepool
And the EC only applies to president so go vote and encourage others to vote in EVERY election not just the 4 year generals!!
sevensided
While the EC is bad, it's not what causes the two partyy system. First Past the Post voting style is what causes two party systems. Ranked choice voting it needed
hyperchondriac
Which would require constitutional amendment, so, not going to happen since the EC benefits the party with structural advantage in the senate due to having dominance in many, low population states.
trigonman3
CGP Grey's short video on First Past the Post, and why voting 3rd party under it is a bad thing to do:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7tWHJfhiyo
hairlessOrphan
Did you know: AOC and Mamdani - and Tiffany Caban, another Democratic Socialist and now on the NYC City Council - all came out of the same electoral district in NYC. How did that happen? After the 2016 election, people in that district LEARNED HOW TO GET CANDIDATES INTO THE PRIMARIES. Why did I put that in all caps? Hmmm curious indeed.
tzahtman
Broken caps lock, right?
Theshnazzyone
It's like voting in the primaries matter or something. "How do we get these bad democrats?!" I dunno maybe people who choose to be clueless about the electoral process bitch and complain rather than taking part in the primary that decides who the democrats we vote for are.
mardukkur
If you don't participate in the primary election and then complain that the party doesn't represent your policy preferences you can just fuck allllllll the way off. If you're not voting for your guys to represent you in this broad coalition of basically everybody who isn't a giant piece of shit, who do you think is going to win? It's the people whose supporters DO vote for them!
yourdesiredusernameisnotavailable
The secret ingredient turned out to be, they showed up to vote on primary day
ButtscratchMcPherson
No no no, it makes more sense to only install a purity test in the general. Its NEVER the voters responsibility to vote in primaries to make the general election candidate better.
RatsLiveOnNoEvilStar
Thank you. Its a matter of putting the right candidate in the "vote blue no matter who" position which means the primaries are even more important than ever.
ThinkingInCode
This. Vote progressive candidates who don’t take corporate PAC or AIPAC money in the primaries, and then vote blue in the Elections.
ButtscratchMcPherson
Yep. Meanwhile dipshits are still advocating we should let maga win if the general election candidate isn't pure enough.
RatsLiveOnNoEvilStar
"Don't let perfection be the enemy of progress"
ButtscratchMcPherson
Just blows my mind that we're in the 2nd Trump admin and we're still having self proclaimed ultra liberals/progressives arguing that the strategy to defeating maga is to let them win general elections instead of actually showing up to vote in primaries.
RatsLiveOnNoEvilStar
Or maybe even running themselves.
The best thing about how our government works is that everyone can participate and there are very few things that bar a citizen from representing their demographic/interests.
CycloneSP
so few ppl even know what primaries are. I only learned they existed a few years ago.
RatsLiveOnNoEvilStar
For some reason, most US voters only think about the presidential election and then only after the primaries are done.
People need to activily participate in their democracy on at least the most basic level of voting in the elections.
I envy the countries that have manditory participation. At least then we would get an accurate indication of what the entire body of people actually wanted and not just 2/3s of it.
CycloneSP
I fear a lot of that is by intent. american's aren't taught about elections beyond the presidential one, for the most part. and most local elections don't make the news cycles most ppl pay attention to, so it completely goes under the radar for most ppl. and I fear that's what most politicians want, so that there's less volatility for them
PirateArrrgument
Primaries are rigged in more than half the local elections. Nobody gets on the ballot that isn't supposed to in Nevada. It's the same in most states, especially in rural areas.
Donfolstar
Yes. I've tried three times in three places to get involved with local Democrats and they were all terrible. Though what does one expect from a party that hasn't had a real primary for POTUS since 2008?
hairlessOrphan
Primaries were rigged in that district, too. The guy AOC beat in the primary was the county's Democratic party boss. https://www.wral.com/story/crowley-s-loss-heralds-an-end-of-an-era-last-of-the-party-bosses/17663218/ You should be asking yourself: what did the voters there do differently?
PirateArrrgument
They got their votes actually counted, for one. So the vote wasn't rigged that hard.
hairlessOrphan
Well, as long as your stance is, "there's nothing I can do about it," then none of this is for you.
RanOutofWit
Yeah. If you have any kind of actual organization for change over there, consider how NZ ditched the two party system and got an actual representative parliament. Might be a good model for the change over there.
ButtscratchMcPherson
Yes, but in the US, making that change requires actually winning massively for multiple terms.
ipointoutnahtzeesbyreplyingtothem
Your entire country is half the population of NYC. What worked for you isn't going to work in the US. hth
oddmog
I mean, yes it's a shithole country and many fight to keep it with developing world levels of poverty and stupidity but I dunno I'm dumb enough to still have hope for junta countries like russia and usa
michiyl
So, democracy can work in India, but not in the USA?
Jimmah1
Some systems actually work better with a larger pool. Your limited ability to comprehend that systems can work for a small and large country, isn't the faults of those systems, but the school system. Which could also be improved by using those programs that smaller countries use.
mrsidog1
Any system can be scaled.
ricpaul
off topic but when I started uni chem tech a professor summarized what the study was about by telling a story: scientist made an essential new material and immediately a factory was build to mass-produce it. When they had finished making a huge batch in the factory, they asked the scientist how he got the material out. He said: I smashed the flask it was in... Study was indeed not as much about chemistry as I had hoped but more about process tech, scaling, thermodynamics, etc..
RanOutofWit
Sure, sure, you have nothing to learn from any other countries. Nothing can change. No other possible reform system will work on the USA.
Or you could look at how NZ went from a massive, riot-level mess of political polarization into a reasonable rational country, and learn something that might - might - be worked into something for the USA. Fuck, maybe there is wisdom outside of the grand boarders of the United States of Assholes. If you pull your head out of your ass.
ipointoutnahtzeesbyreplyingtothem
The point was not that the system won't work in the US, the point was that it is significantly more difficult to change the entire voting system of a country with 350,000,000 versus 5,000,000. Congrats for being a myopic dipshit.
RanOutofWit
Except your starting post literally was just a dismissive "isn't going to work in the US".
I didn't say it would be easy, or you could copy their system. In NZ it took multiple election cycles where it was a major issue parties ended up having to campaign on, against their best interest, before it was implemented. Before that point the political divide was America in miniature.
Honestly, population isn't the problem for you so much as Fox News propaganda.
But do go on, you be you.
NoodlesDOTExe
As a U.S. Citizen: I don't claim them as one of us. I wish we could look to other countries for inspiration as to what we could be for a better future...instead of...well, y'know.
Chereazi
What happens if republicans don't get any votes anymore?
They'll have to move left of Dems to get voters again. Or a new party pops up taking their spot instead. The further right party winning over and over is what causes the US to drift to the right, if you'd cut them out, they're forced to disband or reform. Which would allow better options to pop up.
Y'all just keep killing that process in the root by doing shit like moving all progress back by a century by letting Trump win...
Chereazi
Basically, the fundamental flaw in that post is that nothing would change by voting for Dems, except Dems going further right.
And that's just not what would be happening. Competition within Dems, competition from independents, and competition from a potentially reformed party DOES exist, and can thrive in an environment without far right republicans.
zackingsman
Got nothing to say now, do you?
Chereazi
What?
I've already told you that you're literally just a moronic trolling Trump supporter, and not even a good one xD
May you get to feel the consequences of your actions :3
zackingsman
I am not a trump voter.
mardukkur
You're literally here arguing in support of Trump. Who cares how you secretly behave in the voting booth when you're out here in public promoting your boy?
Chereazi
I've said Trump supporter. Learn to read comrade.
zackingsman
How dare I not support genocide. How could I have the audacity to stand up for what I believe in. How can you attack someone who is on your side? Somebody like me?
meme2zombie
Chereazi
You're supporting over 30 million people dying (so far) due to Trump winning. Whatever you believe in is fucking stupid. And I'm European left. Bernie is a centrist by my standards. And you're just a fucking moron, we're definitely not on the same side there xD
zackingsman
Far right Democrats shall never win, and that's the damn point. That's why Donald supported Andrew Cuomo over Curtis sliwa. That would have never happened except for a progressive nipping at their heels.
magewareinc
Kid, you're points here has some validity.
But you're bitching about bad cell service while the house is on fire. Does your carrier overcharge or drop calls for no reason? Yes. But, for fuck's sake, call the goddamn fire department while you can and worry about the other shit when the fire's under control.
c0i9z
Far right democrats are still better than a Republican who's even further right, is the thing.
zackingsman
For right Democrats is how you get farther right Republicans. Left Democrats is how you get moderate Republicans. How the f*** do you think we got Trump? We got here because no. Executive branch MF stood up for the American people for decades. That is to say FDR was the last pro-american president before a long line of corporate presidential cuckolds. And that is why we have Trump my friend. Remember that Trump supported Andrew Cuomo vs Zohran not Curtis sliwa
c0i9z
No one's saying don't choose the left democrat over the right democrat. They're saying choose the right democrat over the republican.
RatsLiveOnNoEvilStar
We got Trump because we elected a black man twice and it pissed off the racists. They had 8 years to stew in their juices and a demagogue played them like a fiddle.
yikesaroni
this post doesnt make sense. how does refusing to participate move the Dems left? instead it gives republicans the win. wheres the "unassailable logic"?
you support the candidate that most closely aligns with your views in the primary. if you dont win there then you keep the republicans out of power in the general election. thats the pragmatic adult thing to do. i think youre banking on "if people suffer enough under far-right repubs they might start choosing my candidate in primaries?"
UncleMartha
Yeah, about those primaries...
ahb1020306
Whoosh!!
Wyndynwyre
As a worker, my only real power comes from the threat of withholding my labor. As a voter, the only real power I have is the threat of withholding my vote. If we blindly vote blue everytime, there is no incentive for them to change.
wandermanspacebot
Yeah, because after a historic loss to a more conservative GOP candidate what usually happens is that Dems move to the left /s
Wyndynwyre
All the more reason to abandon them as a party: they aren't interested in being progressive or reducing harm. At best they stall until the next conservative takes power, at worst they actively enable the conservative agenda.
Kungfuandtitties
It makes perfect sense in the context that the establishment seems to completely forget this concept when the voters choose a candidate like Mamdani and then all of sudden it's crickets from people like Schumer as far as endorsing or you get a slow walked tepid endorsement like Jeffries eventually gave
RecurringNightmare
the issue is that the US is so incredibly fucked that people get frustrated...people on the left want a left candidate to finally implement all the changes they have wanted for decades...but in reality they first need a candidate who can win at all (so, not a woman, not gay, not coloured, because all that still doesnt work today), then they gotta undo all the changes trump made, invest in education to undo the maga brainwashing, and then wait 3 decades before actual progress can be made again...
AShartInTheWind
Harris would have won if she hadn't been so adamant about supporting Israel or bolstering the DHS further.
AShartInTheWind
How does supporting the Democrats despite their rightward movement shift them back left? They don't work for us and continuing to support them only tells them that it doesn't matter what they do.
NinjablazerZero
My guy, banking on people suffering under far right is the current entire strategy of Dems right fucking now, and in the last 3 election cycles. That is why they keep losing and why Vote Blue no matter who no longer works.
Dems cannot keep running on "Republicans bad." They need to actually offer something tangible, but they keep refusing to do so.
pm1001
Yup. Same logic that refused to vote dem cos of Gaza.
CJGeringer
I won't say I agree but I understand the rationale.
If lefties stop automatically voting for Dems and they lose because the righties vote for the Republicans, they will be forced to actually court the leftist vote.
crazyspelling
Only if they care about *winning* instead of *fundraising*.
mikeatike
Cause then he can whine and bitch about it while doing nothing useful.
PurpleMoonFlower
There's only one way to fight fascism but Americans are to cowardly to do it.
keyblader1985
I'm pretty sure it's say this now so that we have BETTER options than "bad" and "less bad." Also so that good candidates actually manage to get through the primaries. It's not saying don't vote blue at all; it's saying to vote for the BEST blue available, and also fight for that person in the time before the election.
WaterUnderTheRocketAppliances
Just more bullshit from the same assholes while refused to vote against trump and got us into the current situation. Ramping up the propaganda bots again in preparation for the midterm elections.
TheMershedPerderder
You would have move backwards to fight for a good Democrat in the primaries- in 2016 when Bernie was beating Hilary in the primaries, I went to an establishment Democrat party, where they had all but declared here the winner. Their assumption was then she would be the obvious winner, since people would 'vote blue no matter who's, even though they only wanted to offer an establishment, war hawk, subpar candidate.
shehdbeuebw738373
Bernie is blue (or was in that instance) and he lost the primary according to the rules he knew the primary would use (plus just by straight up votes). And we have no earthly idea if he would have won.
"a man comes home and masturbates to his typical fantasy" hadn't even been used on him yet, and Trump was practically campaigning for him to sow division.
RecurringNightmare
many analysts said that nominating hillary was "giving trump the only opponent he could beat"...a woman just cannot stand up to a bully, if she doesnt she appear weak, like she did, if she fights back she appears bitchy, it was a lose-lose situation...bernie definitely would have performed better, and it was close, so we absolutely have an idea, he would have very likely won...
shehdbeuebw738373
We're literally replying to a comment that says "these establishment Dems thought she'd win for sure, what morons" and you pull out "obv Bernie woulda won, analysts were so sure."
No analysts thought Hillary would lose, either. This is all 20/20 hindsight. Sure, if I had a time machine I'd see if we could try him out, but no one can know what would happen. And I'm not even sure what you are proposing - do we ignore primary results? If a leftist primaries and loses, that's that isn't it?
mardukkur
At no point was Bernie beating Hillary in the primaries.
TheMershedPerderder
You can literally Google it https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Democratic_Party_presidential_primaries
mardukkur
Complete with this helpful graph to clear up whatever confusion you seem to have. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/57/Nationwide_polls_for_the_2016_Democratic_Party_presidential_primaries.svg/2560px-Nationwide_polls_for_the_2016_Democratic_Party_presidential_primaries.svg.png
BeatriceAine
It doesn't say don't vote Democrat. The point is to be more informed about the platform not just the party affiliation. Vote for people that push the values you want.
LicensedAdHominem
It misses the point of the chant, too. It never meant "vote even for a fascist with a 'D' by their name". It means "we all know the presidential choices aren't ideal but for the love of all that's good in the world VOTE but NOT FOR TRUMP". It means to grasp the consequences of all possible choices instead of clinging to the "moral purity" of the choice itself, which is an egotistical farce.
Because SOME PEOPLE went "fuck you, I won't vote at all", ceding turnout to far right as usual.
Meowsma
It may never have meant that, but that's the effect. That's how you get the Joe "we must empower ICE and the Palestinian genocide as much as possible" Bidens and Gavin "trans and homeless people aren't people" Newsom.
The post is right in that Democrats won't do shit if they know they can expect your vote except move right.
Risk one election to start moving meaningfully left or just move right in small steps and great leaps? At what point in the latter do trans people get their rights?
cambam3000
I think it's important to recognize that the post doesn't say "vote Dem for the rest of your life." If in some theoretical future the Republicans become at least within a reasonable level of sanity OR the system changes and more political parties are added then not voting Dem may be a great idea. For now though seeing a candidate you don't really like and saying "nah I won't vote" when the alternative is straight fascist dictatorship is insane
IDontKnowWhatToDoAnymoreAndImTired
It doesn't. It's pure lies. This is the same bullshit from the same ratfucking operatives who told us there was no difference between Bush and Gore, who told us Hillary was just as bad as Trump, and who told us that Trump was better for Gaza than Harris. It's the exact same right-wing water-carrying that got us here.
There are exactly two viable options in any given election in the US: Nazis, and Anti-Nazis. If you're not supporting the Anti-Nazis, then you're supporting the Nazis. Period.
mobyclick
Daems are not anti Nazi they are in collusion with them
IDontKnowWhatToDoAnymoreAndImTired
You're either lying to yourself, or you're lying to others. Either way, you're a tool.
wandermanspacebot
You're a moron.
JollyJokzr
The post is intended to discourage democrat voters from voting instead of voting in the primaries.
mddblue
THIS
ButtscratchMcPherson
Its almost like the people pushing this shit are really magaists/Russians/anarchists wanting maga to win.
TheMindEntropic
Everybody listen to Buttscratch McPherson and you'll get exactly what you deserve.
ButtscratchMcPherson
As opposed to your strategy of letting maga win general elections?
johnxbear
What's your plan? Vote republican and hope the leopards don't eat your face because you voted for them?
TheMindEntropic
I'm Australian, but American politics are global politics and have been for some time. I can't vote for your Pedophile-in-Chief that you all elected, but I can get involved with the ongoing conversation via internet. The fact that you can see "option 1" and "option 2" as the only possible options is strong evidence of what I read about the American education system and how half of you can only read at the 6th grade level.
Listen: Criticising the democrats does not automatically mean support
AmaraDela
You misspelled your username. It's TheMindAtrophic
TheMindEntropic
Americans are so extraordinarily stupid. You're like cows being slaughtered and the only tools that can be offered to help you, you're too willfully ignorant to pick up and use.
ThingsThatDontJustifyGenocide
Democrats go to the right. Republicans go to the right. VOTE BLUE TO OPPOSE REPUBLICANS NO MATTER WHO, EVEN FETTERMEN OR SINEMA OR NEWSOM OR MANCHIN NO MATTER WHO, democrats go to the right, republicans go to the right, VOTE BLUE TO OPPOSE, BLUE NO MATTER WH---
Fuck off. Push for socialists, push for progressives and leftists.
phalanxausage
That's what primaries are for
ThingsThatDontJustifyGenocide
Yes. I didn't use the word primary, but that's when "push for" is done.
Rogahar
And if none of them make it onto the ballot, what then? Genuinely, I'm asking what the plan is when the only options given are D or R.
PurpleMoonFlower
A General strike would be a good start.
cambam3000
Push for socialists while keeping the worst of the worst out of office. These people who think you can't do both are a little silly
Go to a voting booth, vote blue. Go home, grab your stuff, protest. But you're protesting for them to be more socialist instead of less fascist, which will be easier and probably involve less deaths
ButtscratchMcPherson
Trump thanks you for your support, comrade. Also learn the difference between primary and general elections.
ThingsThatDontJustifyGenocide
Enjoy that bootleather, fascist.
ButtscratchMcPherson
You're literally the one helping bring about fascism, boot sucker.
AShartInTheWind
The Dems have primaries? I can't think of at least two Dem primaries in recent history that have either been rigged or didn't happen at all.
DutchBoeremeisie
The post would only make sense if there was a viable third option.
zackingsman
If Zohran ain't a viable third option. I don't know what the fuck is. Y'all is definitely not the brightest branches on the Birch.
SisyphusRollin
The democrat Zohran, the one in the democratic party Zohran, the Vote Blue Democrat Zohran?
IDontKnowWhatToDoAnymoreAndImTired
Zohran Mamdani is a Democrat.
ButtscratchMcPherson
Zohran ran in the Democratic primary, won it, and then ran as a Democrat in the general. Are you ignorant, stupid, or trolling?
DutchBoeremeisie
Is he not a Democrat?
zackingsman
Establishment Democrats refuse to stand behind him. They know he's not a Democrat. Bernie Sanders is not a Democrat ilhan Omar is not a Democrat. Real Democrats are Nancy pelosi, Chuck Schumer, Richie Torres real Democrats are bad people. They are really bad and the only way to get those Democrats out is to undermine them and out primary them.
usernameusedinlessplatforms2
So primary the "real democrats" out, make ppl like them the DEM stabdard. Problem solved, innit?
Nonada
He still ran as and won as a Democrat though. So no, not a third option, but rather people going out and making someone good win the primary. Bernie Sanders literally isn't a Democrat, he's an independent who caucuses with them.
IDontKnowWhatToDoAnymoreAndImTired
Ah, now we see the "No True Scotsman" fallacy come into play. Democrats you approve of are okay, Democrats you don't are evil. Please take whatever excuses you give yourself for your helping Trump into office to kill children and cage minorities and fuck right off with that shit.