zoraniko
30298
533
9
https://www.reddit.com/r/USCIS/comments/1ptamcy/is_this_real/
Dec 23, 2025 1:07 AM
zoraniko
30298
533
9
https://www.reddit.com/r/USCIS/comments/1ptamcy/is_this_real/
Garwain
This is also a reason it's bad to have a bunch of draconian federal codes that are arbitrarily enforced. Maybe it can be fine in sane times, but when bad people are at the helm...
ruint
use it to apply for asylum in canada
CaptainSkyhawk
Cruelty is the point.
Eciah
There was an update on the post on reddit, looks like the A#s attached to the document and their citizenship certificate are different so could be for someone elses case not the OP's case. Check in the link they provided to read the whole thing.
WackyWavingInflatableArmFlailingTubman
Under the law statute of limitations doesnt apply if an active warrant was issued before the statute of limitations was up. It could be 20 years later and they would well be within their right to arrest you regardless if you went thru the naturalization process. Which would now be invalid anyway as being a fugitive of the US would disqualify you from citizen ship. It sucks but thats the law and this person broke it. Be prepared to have your day ruined
whadyameanthatnamestaken
If this was delivered via certified mail, the addressee HAS to sign for it to be considered delivered. This sounds like BS to me for this reason and others. Get a lawyer.
xj4low
If you never signed for it, then you didn't get it. Nothing official can hold up based on this letter. Take it the hell down.
WellAckchually
I have received multiple certified letters and signature required packages where they just dropped them off
MyCatsAreTypingThis
The government can send certified mail without signature required. I received several tax notices from the IRS certified that were just left in my mailbox. Remember, they don't play by our rules. But yes, this person needs to see a lawyer ASAP.
AntaNce
From USPS: Someone MUST sign for certified mail. Doesn't have to be addressee. https://c360faq.usps.com/s/article/Certified-Mail-The-Basics
backrideup9
Except they went and proved to the world that they indeed did receive it. They're about to learn a very hard lesson that not everything in their life needs to be shared with the world.
AntaNce
Unless the sender bought 'restricted delivery' certified, this is NOT proof the addressee got the letter. If not, ANYONE can sign for it.
ExTechOp
Proving whom u/noneyahbisnas (this of course is not @OP) is may be somewhat difficult in a way that would stand up in court.
Rubbishtheresnoway9peopleusetaniwhida
Remember when everyone wanted to move to America?
VinnieJonesDiary
Nope?
Lovethesmelloftoastedsourdoughbread
Uh, no?
INeedMoreGifMeMoreJustOneMore
Eddie Murphy should make a new movie: "Getting the fuck out of America"
Kosjir
No, but I remember a time when I was young enough to still believe the lies we were told by the media, government, teachers, and parents about how everyone wanted to move here.
Fentex
Never been the case.
CheeseB0t
No?
Samantha4u
land of the f- of the king? Huh.
InevitableBadger
My ancestors wanted to go to America in about 1900. They were tricked off the boat early on the grounds that the ship needed repairs, but it never came back. It was a common story in that community. Periodically I count my blessings.
Rubbishtheresnoway9peopleusetaniwhida
Really?
Where was that from ?
Merry Christmas 🎄 BTW
InevitableBadger
Eastern Europe, escaping the Russian Empire recruiting for its army
LZYRMN
Did they? Most of us Canadians didn’t.
InTangier
I remember when folks wanted to move to Canada. Not particularly easy, too, but at least it's Canada. It's mind-boggling to me how hard moving to the US is for most of the world, especially considering how much of a downgrade it is. I mean, there's an entire movie industry based on telling the world how amazing the US is, what did they expect? Tourism?
LZYRMN
“come to America where your kids aren’t safe at school, at the mall, at parades, clubs, or anywhere really. We really like our guns because we think having a gun will stop other shooters except we never actually do that. But we will argue about it to death. Oh and we got racism galore and we single handedly destroyed our tourism country because Trump is a genius.”
InTangier
You only get that in US news, if you can call it that. From Hollywood you get a shitload of US Defaultism on steroids, bald eagle riding a Harley while firing a minigun, explosions in the back, directed by Michel Bay. It's kinda weird lol
CharlesMontgomeryBurns
There are large communities of people descended from Canadians who came over, particularly in New England. Both of my grandmother's families were from Quebec. So most didn't, but many did.
kingbobsfanner
I ask immigrants I meet all the time, "What do people think America is like? Is it still some place of dreams wherever you're from?" They say yes, and then go on to say they wish they hadn't come. I want to go to other countries too, just not here. I can't imagine coming here being my dream.
tidepool
There are places in this world far more dangerous to live in, especially for women, so it makes sense that it feels like a land of dreams and freedom. It’s just really really really expensive to chase it.
SpammersAreScum
The answer to ClubZealousideal8211 is not what was given, but what was stated earlier: The naturalization is invalid if there was an outstanding order of removal. Apparently -- I'm not an expert on the matter, but would seem to make sense. One thing that's not clear is whether the recipient was aware of the order and ignored it
Pervaroo
I get that mistakes happen, but shouldn't the onus be on the government to know whether they want you gone or not before blessing your citizenship? It seems crazy that something like that doesn't put a blocker in the system that prevents everything at "Step 1" when they start processing the paperwork.
KerryCoder
This isn't a mistake. As another poster suggested, they may be "backdating" removal orders in order to remove naturalized citizens. In other words - fraud.
PMAW
At this point I think they are creating backdated removal orders that don't really exist to meet their goals. They promised to deport 10x the amount of illegal immigrants in the US and they aim to do it.
SalvadoroftheDali
They actually aren’t doing a very good job. Biden and Obama did way better with better tactics..
PMAW
Because they are both intelligent and cared about the law and the constitution, not sound bites and tweets.
Telemapus
I presume you got downvoted for saying "way better", but you're right that Biden and Obama deported a LOT more people compared to Trump 1.0, by having DHS do actual work to figure out who could be deported. Trump 2.0 it remains to be seen because the other figures are for four year terms. But Obama was 3.1 million (in term 1) compared to Trumps 1 million (in term 1).
tidepool
This is why he’s going so hard. He wants to beat Obama and Biden’s numbers. It’s always retribution with him.
Arbitrarynamehere
He's also a Nazi
Omnimorph2112
Making a lot more people illegal (even when they're not) seems very much like something this government would do.
Tenugui
It's something they have very much already done.
Pervaroo
That's exactly what they're doing by going to courthouses and arresting people who are showing up for hearings. They're preventing people from following procedures then claiming "you failed to follow the law, so we're kicking you out."
tidepool
They’re discussing denaturalization options, and not just for Hispanics but Black guilds now too. No one is safe. I wouldn’t even count on it as a white person because they’re planning to round up homeless and send them to a concentration camp being built in Utah. RFK is talking about his work camps again, too, which is where a lot of neurodivergent and disabled folks are gonna end up. Im not being hyperbolic, I’m pretty sure most of this was in P25 save for RFKs organic death camps.
tidepool
Black folks* stupid autocorrupt.
GoodChange
If they were never informed, how can they be expected to pay?
GeekDadKevin
They aren't expected to pay. They are expected to relinquish all assets and self deport.
kadaeux
Because the government (any of them) doesn't generally care if you were informed.
SonOfScubaSam
They can't, silly :) Now they get to go to jail or deported, isn't that better? /s
CallMeCourierSix
You act like failure to notify is something the current administration gives a fuck about. Or that they give a fuck about any legal requirements. At all.
TacticoolWolf
There are over 100k laws in Cali, and over 300k federal laws. In Chico, California, there's a $500 fine to detonate a nuclear device within city limits. Any one of these could be enforced by a government any time they simply don't like an individual.
cousteau
Step 1: make new law on the spot. Step 2: make it retroactive. Step 3: give zero fucks about it being illegal to do that because you're the Government and therefore above the law.
thundercactus
Ah it's easy, just send them a check but redact all the important information on it
crazyspelling
Proper notice is a very important element of nearly every formal fine procedure. But evidence of proper notice can be some schmuck signing a proof of service swearing that they mailed a piece of paper, and there's basically no way to disprove it. The law assumes an addressed, stamped letter arrived. Because the person who did the mailing is generally not the person levying or collecting the fine, their sworn statement is usually good evidence. Need some contemporaneous evidence of stolen mail.
MarkRavingMad
Because we're living in a Kafka novel
GreenMnM
Ignorance of whatever law or rule we cooked up to rob and deported you is not an excusable action for not paying/deporting
RealityInflicted
When it comes to the governments money the burden of evidence is always on the accused. When about the moniez the norm is assumed guilty until proven (by you) innocent.
AgamemnonsMemes
"Ignorance of the law is not an excuse" its always the way
zobPilot
This is the way
Exyr
Oh they dont care. I was never informed about something and didnt find out until the levied my bank account taking 18k. They could find out who I banked with but not my address.
EroticZombiePants
Because Trump says so, and TRUMP IS THE LAW now.
sadurdaynight
I got a call saying my jury duty was cancelled. I called them back and said i never recieved the summons for it. They said i did, bc someone got the letter and signed me up. I asked what verification do they use to ensure it's me and not just someone who intercepted my mail. They said you just plug in an id number from the mailer. That's it. I told them that is dumb. They said if i skipped I'd still be on the hook. I told them how crazy that sounds. They don't care.
crazyspelling
It is crazy. And unavoidable. You have to comprehend that the number of people who intercept mail to sign someone up for jury duty and not tell them is astronomically, quantum-level small, when compared to the number of people that would happily lie about it to try to get out of jury duty. "Inadvertently unhelpful helpful family member" is the only rational scenario, and it's not good enough for an excuse, because they're supposed to tell you.
Namotatop
If a system is set up so that a malicious actor could easily ruin a life, and the only reason the system doesn't offer any protection against it is because "surely nobody would take that option and hurt someone else", then it's a dogshit system.
crazyspelling
Considering I've had a certified letter *with tracking* that the USPS says "isn't lost, it's at the Sanat Cruz distribution facility" and has been there for *three years,* I am inclined to agree.
CarInAVet
Where I live, they just send you a letter and expect you to show up. My dad worked offshore and once came home to a letter saying he had jury duty on a day that had already passed. There wasn't any trouble once he called and explained the situation but still.
bittenicht39
“There’s no point in acting surprised about it. All the planning charts and demolition orders have been on display at your local planning department in Alpha Centauri for 50 of your Earth years, so you’ve had plenty of time to lodge any formal complaint and it’s far too late to start making a fuss about it now."
phalanxausage
Even in this scenario they had the good sense to be wary of the leopard rather than invite it to eat your face
VagrantKoba
I don't know why I have been seeing Hitch-hikers Guide to the Galaxy comments all day on Imgur, but I ain't mad
GoodChange
EverNotRelevant
"Because it's the law, and we want to be cruel" that's how.
19marcurious57
We want to. Because we can. And we wil...
minipancho94
Remember. Its a LEGAL system, not a JUSTICE system.
19marcurious57
GoodChange
It says: ”…an order of removal … was made final…”. So it’s not that they took an action that violated a law, some judge decided that they should be removed. How can that be legal until they are informed, especially if they are later informed that they are a citizen. At the very least the payment should not start piling up until they have been informed. There’s no way handing them the paper like this is even a little bit legal. / of course I see what they do on the daily but…
GoodChange
It just seems like in any not-a shithole-country, a judge would automatically review the case and find a solution.
EverNotRelevant
You're right. Some leniency and understanding SHOULD be extended. But I don't expect it to happen in the current political climate.
donthaveonebrojustlurk
When you say political climate.....the weather changes and so do the seasons, but fascism needs to be burned back. Just sayin.