CrimsonPermanentAssurance
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Jul 4, 2026 4:19 AM
CrimsonPermanentAssurance
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[deleted]
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ImmaCatImmaSexyCat
"Why is Sarah some militia badass? Last time we saw her she was just a waitress in a diner. They killed off the strong male lead just so Sarah can replace him through some bullshit, totally off-screen character development? Anything to get your girlboss, eh Cameron?"
Thisisbullshitalready
DAMN GOOD MOVIE! I can't even guess at how many times I've seen it. Serious rewatchability.
DrDadJokes
Happy 35th T2
DavedandConfused
I saw this movie at the Drive-In, with my two best friends, when it came out.
Draco245
Terminator is played by an immigrant too. Though he's white, so it's alright.
Trassation
So would Aliens. A snarky female lead who is in charge and directs men twice her size with more training than her and who single handedly walks into the heart of the hive after most of the Marines are dead. And then there's Ramirez. A tiny ginger actress with face paint to make her character Latina who talks down to men twice her size, but is so badass that the aliens can't touch her and the only thing that can ultimately kill her is herself.
LazyLout
Vasquez, Ramirez was Sean Connery in Highlander. Close enough though.
OtisTDrunk
BallsToYouMyGoodSir
still never seen any of them
DTNemes
That person has no idea what "woke" means.
Bundalicious
It also depicted Mexicans as productive members of society.
OtisTDrunk
Imjurbro
Do the Alien franchise (at least the first two movies) next :p.
anjeleyezjr
Nope. I don't even give us 50 more years til we extinct ourselves.
conlanabu
were parasitoids, we will survive even if the earth does, even if the sun doesnt. we will just keep going
YuffieK
nurmich
Ripley and Sarah Conner would both absolute badasses.
CaldariBob
You mean, like, in a movie? Together?
nurmich
That should've been "*were both absolute badasses" but I got too excited.
CaldariBob
I understand.
TyrannusEquus
Honestly I would love to see them in a movie together. They are the archetype for how I wanted to be growing up. You got to maintain a level head under pressure and bring all the firepower you can against your foes. I also learned to lock pick because of T2.
ThinkThisOut
…. Why wouldn’t you learn how to hack an atm? Did you even watch the movie?!
RyanH42
It vilifies AI too.
joshuasplinth
Nah, they'd call her a lesbian for not falling for a man, and they'd still have a woody from the robot DRESSED as a cop running people down and killing them.
GCRust
Yeah but the robot dressed as a cop masqueraded as a woman briefly, so clearly this is all part of the Trans agenda. /s
joshuasplinth
But don’t you see?? This is exactly why we need genitalia inspectors in the bathrooms. To stop the Wokecepticons!
DorgEndo
Sarah Conner is an unwed single mother who got what she deserved after her slutty one night stand /s
PirateArrrgument
Point of order: the bad guy isn't a cop, but impersonates one.
SeenItDoneIt
If it looks like a duck; walks like a duck; swims like a duck; quacks like a duck, it's probably a duck!
Lampmonster
Sure but they chose to have his main form an LAPD officer precisely because of their reputation when that movie came out.
frozenlake247
Also the important bit that it was utterly believable that a cop (or person dressed like one) could go around acting like a killing machine without anyone suspecting anything out of the usual was happening.
Like would anyone then or now actually expect news bulletins or major police activity admitting an apparent rogue cop was on a rampage?
No way the PD wouldn’t have seen the mall pics etc and been like “why was bob even at the mall, has he been through the station?”
mobyclick
... And why did he choose a cop to impersonate?
PirateArrrgument
Because nobody thinks twice about a police officer asking people questions, looking up addresses, or attempting to track down a known juvenile delinquent. A police officer, especially after the heavy copaganda TV shows of the 80s and 90s, was at the time a trusted position to the majority of the US.
GayBondageMaster
He was literally the first person he stumbled upon.
Lampmonster
The writers made that decision though. They very much decided to make the villain's main form LAPD for the social commentary.
AdmiralButtStuff
I understand Edward Furlong wasn't the most masculine teenager, but he's literally the main character in Terminator 2.
levyathyn
The post says A female lead. Not THE female lead.
ElbowDeepInAPoliceState
I read that as female lead, not lead. Made everything very confusing
levyathyn
Female lead poisoning? Well it probably tastes better than regular lead at least
Molvanian
A movie can have more than one lead, and often people talk about one male and one female lead. The post specified the female lead.
The leads get large amounts of screen time, the main character is the center of the story.
John is the Main Character. He's also a lead. Sarah Conners doesn't get as much screen time as him, but gets a bunch, some of it independent of him. She is the female lead.
Snooj
In the same way that Dani was the main character in Dark Fate. Which is to say, not.
mrthewhitee
Just because a story centers on a character doesn't make them the main character.
John Connor was a human McGuffin the terminators fought over.
mobyclick
We're not gonna make it, are we?
jasondeslin
Best reply ever.
conlanabu
The Future isnt set. there is no fate but what we make for ourselves.
Kbantar
He was the McGuffin, not the main character.
stabbermcshooty
Is a mcguffin similar to a mulligan?
keyserv
Nah. A McGuffin is a plot device. A mulligan is pretty much a second chance.
PipWhipple
Wasn't the chip at that lab the McGuffin? Or was that something else?
MrAcurite
I don't think you could replace him with a nice lamp from IKEA and leave the story unchanged. Therefore, he's not actually a MacGuffin.
Freakscar
Not to be the ackchuallay guy, but: Yes you could. Small twist in the story to make said ikea lamp irreplaceable for the restiance against Skynet, which is, because reasons, in Sarah Connors hands - voila. T1000 hunts Sarah, T800 returns to the rescue.
That is per definition a mcguffin.
Cearnaigh
He did qualify 'leave the story unchanged' though.
Showing that the T1000 can be taught somewhat akin to compassion is also a big part of said story, which probably wouldn't work with a lamp.
Unless the robot thought it was a really sexy lamp.
Marikhen
They practically did just that with Terminator 3... I'm being facetious, but the John Connor character wasn't great, and I'm not sure Nick Stahl did the role any favors. It doesn't help that the movie really felt like it set up Claire Danes' character, Kate Brewster, as the main character instead of John Connor who just happened to be along for the ride. The changes to the T-800 persona don't help either from a, "nice lamp from IKEA" perspective. >_>
TheRealCrimesJohnson
Lots of films have multiple lead characters, often one male and one female - I think the point is that, in this case, the female lead doesn’t have (or need/want) any romantic interest, when they’re usually there to fall in love with the male lead
doctorId
If the movie came out today it would end with Sarah Connor making out with the T-800 in front of her son.
BananaForScaIe
These days it's more often "found family" (just finished polishing a script for netflix that was pure found family). There's a "lead" (starlord in guardians) but the "lead" isn't in more than 50% of the scenes so the idea of a "leading man/woman" isn't as prevalent these days.
Obviously still happens (every jason statham movie) but diverse cast draws in diverse audience. Plus more fun dialog for me to write ;)
ShtankyRichards
It’s been a while but I’m pretty sure Reese was her romantic interest. Granted he died in the first movie but in T2 (iirc) she has a dream/vision of them together… so, not exactly accurate.
CaldariBob
The main character got paid $15 million for that movie. Edward Furlong did not get paid $15 million for that movie.
ricpaul
The two main characters from T1 were central to T2. They could have selected one of 100's of young actors for John Connor.
AdmiralButtStuff
No, the bigger name actor got paid $15 million. You went to the theater to see Arnie bust heads, but the movie was about John Connor played by Furlong.
shorey66
Didn't mean he was the main character
crypresthesia
Arnie who plays a Termninator the titular character of the franchise. Your argument is basically "The real main characters of the Friday the 13th movies are the teens and young murdered by Jason Vorhees or someone pretending to be him"
Alistairetheblu
Sure, it's about him, in the way that a lot of movies are about the vaguely-characterized McGuffin.
Draygen
Yeah. Main character in the Pirates of the Caribbean movies are Will Turner, but ain't nobody dressing up like him or quoting him incessantly. Some people have very simple and narrow understanding of storytelling vehicles.
Nephytis
The name of the movie wasn't John Connor tho 😆
CaldariBob
Naw, I'm pretty sure the only ones with a proper character arch were Arnie's & Linda Hamilton's characters. Sure, Furlong was a protagonist, but was he THE protagonist?
albaboss
Who’s the boss?
CaldariBob
Sorry - "arc". Autocorrect.
Maulbert
This argument holds no water. As an example: Mary Poppins is the protagonist of Mary Poppins, but George Banks is the only character with an arc in the film.
Discgolfing
I'm joining this! The name of the movie is a hint of who is THE protagonist AND the antagonist. All other are side characters, except John Connor, who is the macguffin.
CaldariBob
But she brings the Banks children in line. It's the Hero's Journey.
Besides, Julie Andrews got paid $100k for the movie, which I'm assuming was a lot of money at the time.
AdmiralButtStuff
You don't think the character that realized his mom wasn't crazy, and bonded with a machine sent back in time to save him only to have it kill itself in an attempt to save him again had a proper character arc? Have you seen the movie? Arnie's character had a BIT of an arc limited by Arnie not being a very good actor, and playing yanno... a machine, but Hamilton had basically none. If anything, she was vindicated for everything she did between the 1st and 2nd movies.
CaldariBob
Furlong kinda ends up the same place at the end of the movie as he was at the beginning. Meanwhile, Arnie has his "becoming more human" arc, and Linda Hamilton has her whole redemption arc.
keyserv
Whaaaat? The second half of T2 revolves entirely around Sarah Conner's actions and motivations. I could be misunderstanding what you mean, but without John breaking her out of captivity the movie just wouldn't exist as we know it.
keyserv
On a side not, I will agree that Arnie is pretty one dimensional when it comes to acting. But he can deliver one liners pretty well and he can make people chuckle. I guess that goes a long way.