CrypticalEnvelopement
117474
1396
109
The description goes here
Nov 4, 2021 12:29 PM
CrypticalEnvelopement
117474
1396
109
The description goes here
NotoriousBAT
Play stupid games... Win stupid prizes
inkican
That's some total /r/boringdystopia stuff right there - only thing MeeMaw had to leave was that life insurance policy.
ShedTrady
Completely agree.
Treequux
I don't agree with this, especially if it's a policy that the employee was paying into.
AggroMonster
Tough boogins?
sunnychick325
Why do people think this is good? These families just lost someone to a preventable cause. They’re suffering enough, dont add financial ruin
noodleteeth
No, listen, I'm all for not treating unvaccinated people in hospitals. But what about the reasonable people who couldn't talk their parents
noodleteeth
Into getting vaccinated? We should be asking who IS getting that dead mans money.
PuffinHufflepuff
Is it dumb to not get vaccinated if you can? Absolutely. Is this a shit idea that will only hurt the family members left behind? Absolutely.
dontmagpie
good riddance
duoplicity
Should be a special fundraising site just for the resisters; "gofuckme" or something...
zfournier16
Ifuckedmyself
DoctorSniffles
And you can click donate or "gofuckyourself!"
JinxRocks
I hand out a Zero Fucks coin. Tell them that’s all the cash they’re gonna get from me. Their anger makes me laugh.
JinxRocks
Oh and so far, nobody has actually kept the coin. Lol
clubracer
That's fucked
CrypticalEnvelopement
DukeDarkwood
As the top comment says, car insurance has rules about if you're speeding and/or drunk. Deliberately taking higher risks isn't covered.
whatsisname
Wrong. Car insurance pays out for damage you cause while drunk. They have to factor in the risks of people doing dumb shit.
whatsisname
They can drop you after your drunk driving crash, but they're still on the hook.
CrypticalEnvelopement
Do they cover damage to your own vehicle, or damages you caused? Because there's a big difference
whatsisname
Those two are typically two different policies. For liability, they'd have to cover it. If you have comprehensive, they'd fix your car too.
KrazyKatLadyStarterKit
How does that differ from smokers who die of lung cancer?
AggroMonster
First off, this is a benefit bestowed by the employer, NY MTA. 2ndly if a smoker is told "Die of lung cancer, no benefit", it's on him.
TriumphRider24
Fuck around and even your FAMILY finds out
OgreMkV
Always look at what insurance companies are doing. They have to live and pay out in the real world.
AggroMonster
This isn't an insurance company, it's the NY MTA. Their employer. Put the blame on the now-informed anti-vaxxer, who should know better.
chrisat928
You're actively putting yourself at risk.
CrypticalEnvelopement
You're putting OTHERS at risk. Actively putting yourself at risk is fine, risking the safety of others because you're stubborn is NOT okay
TacTheScribbler
I use a dirt bike analogy for this same concept. Take a jump and die? Fine. Don't drive into a crowd of people, tho.
whooptydoo
difference between drunk driving and not wearing a seatbelt. one risks everyone around you, the other only risks yourself and the feelings
whooptydoo
of those who love you.
CrypticalEnvelopement
VashTehStampede
THIS!
FallingStar7669
You're correct, but in this context, it's a matter of the life insurance companies going, "This person clearly wants to die, so we aren't +
FallingStar7669
+ going to pay out any money when they do."
CrypticalEnvelopement
No, it's about risky behaviors not being insurable
dfrinky1337
You two are saying the same thing. It's not really about endangering others when it comes to insurance, it's about risking your own life
AngryGraphicDesigner
So it’s kinda like suicide by ignorance
AggroMonster
Not really, no. They've been told what to do. Get the shot. The only ignorance encountered is when they do not.
Toruko
Willful ignorance! There is a key distinction there.
AngryGraphicDesigner
Agreed!
Fejerro
It's kind of like allowing antivaxxers to destroy their family too when they die by ignorance.
AggroMonster
That's their death benefit. Keep it or throw it away because duhhhhh anti-vax.
Claptonclone
This is nothing more than a shrewd health insurance industry dodge.
AggroMonster
This coverage is provided by their employer - the NY MTA. I guess they're sick and fucking tired of paying out for dead idiot antivaxers.
ICampOntheFirstDate
Company just announced we have to pay $600/yr extra if smoker, and $600 if unvaxed. People already asking for religious exemption for both.
qwertdeep
I don’t mind if people pay extra for being an antivaxxer, not paying out on their deaths is harsh tho
creepwood
relgious exemption to smoke? Rastafarian the bunch?
ICampOntheFirstDate
Our rural plants have a heavy "mah freedoms" mindset and will not hesitate to ask their pastor for a letter condoning smoking, because Jesus
Targe0
I hope this is set up to not fuck over people who medically cant get the vaccine. Because it wouldnt be the first time they got screwed over
Claptonclone
Yeah, all 0.00003% of them.
Targe0
Just because it might be a low percentage doesn't mean their needs should be fucked over. ->
Targe0
Also its not just people who have allergic reactions who are in that group any one with a depleted ->
Targe0
immune system like those on Chemo therapy also can't get it because they have basically no immune system to work with the vaccines. ->
Targe0
And there are other conditions in the same boat. So the number of people these kinds of laws can effect if poorly made is rather large.
FelixG
This is why I loathe people who think this is a good thing, because innocent people fall into the cracks. Antivaxers are idiots but you 1/2
FelixG
shouldn't be fucking over innocent people, and the people they leave behind. Like this could well fuck a teen who was trying to get 2/2
FelixG
their idiot parent to get the vaccine. 3/2
AggroMonster
See “valid documented exception” https://www.thecity.nyc/2021/9/12/22667777/no-covid-death-benefit-for-unvaccinated-mta-bus-subway-workers
DougDeNasty
They'll just have to suffer through all the paperwork and lost time while grieving a lost love one and give a sizable chunk to a lawyer.
shawberry
I would hope that they can file paperwork with thier insurance company from thier dr. Also, I would bet there is past proof that they are
Targe0
Yeah but you know stuff like this can be a nightmare to get an exemption for shit like this.
shawberry
Allergic to other vaccines or ingredients in this vaccine. None of this I have had all the other mandatory vaccines out there but I draw
shawberry
The line at this one kinda bs.
GimmeDaGorbage333
I mean I get it, but it sucks for those of us who legitimately can’t get vaccinated.
AggroMonster
See “valid documented exception” https://www.thecity.nyc/2021/9/12/22667777/no-covid-death-benefit-for-unvaccinated-mta-bus-subway-workers
ProfessorChaos
I'm guessing they evaluate legitimate medical exemptions.
AggroMonster
Yep! “valid documented exception” https://www.thecity.nyc/2021/9/12/22667777/no-covid-death-benefit-for-unvaccinated-mta-bus-subway-workers
evilspock
Nah - it drives the morons around you to get vaccinated, making you safer.
qwertdeep
Not necessarily safer. Can’t we vaccinated ones still transfer covid to the unvaccinated like this commenter? Not following social/
qwertdeep
Distancing and people not wearing masks even though they’re vaccinated is a big risk to the medically exempt. It’s why zero covid should’ve/
qwertdeep
Been a bigger aim than vaccinations (although the pressure on healthcare systems from the unvaccinated can’t be ignored). In all, get/
qwertdeep
Vaccinated if you can and wear a mask + keep social distancing regardless of your vaccination status. Also explain it to those you don’t/
evilspock
Sure, but it's far less likely. "Safer" doesn't mean no risk - it means less risk. I'm vaccinated, but I still mask up when I leave home.
qwertdeep
My tl;dr is basically mask up if you’re vaccinated anyway. Tbh we’re all preaching to the choir in regards to vaccines on here. Also do let/
qwertdeep
People know that the vaccine isn’t designed to reduced transmissions and it didn’t really test that anyway. Not enough people know this in/
AsAHistorian
Ah, I don't know. This seems like it's just fucking over their families, who may not have had anything to do with it. Seems a bit shitty.
AggroMonster
No. Put the blame where it belongs. The Anti-vaxxer who refuses the shot will know beforehand that they're fucking over their families.
awesomecat42
No more shitty than when they refuse to cover other deaths caused by risky behavior like drunk driving.
shankycat
It's insurance, not inheritance. Insurance is a paid-for product. The insurance company won't pay if you purposely jump off a cliff - why
shankycat
should they pay if you are engaging in this suicidal activity?
wannabecowboy
Because depending on your age it isn’t suicidal? At my age, I’m 70 times more likely to die from choking on food than COVID.
shankycat
In the scenario given, you 100% died of COVID though. It's after the fact, not a previous stipulation.
whatsisname
because that's the goddamn point of insurance, to deal with unexpected events, and why you pay to maintain that insurance contract.
shankycat
But premiums do go up for risky behavior, and claims are denied in certain circumstances already. Insurance is a for-profit business. Of
shankycat
course putting yourself at unnecessary risk during a global health emergency would have some stipulations attached. Perhaps it's not fair
whatsisname
Term life insurance premiums are fixed for the duration of the contract. After they write a policy, if I decide to pursue a new career as a
animecrazystyle
Eh. I don't agree with this one. The family shouldnt be punished for that. I am fully pro Vax but this is too far
AggroMonster
Spouse is punishing the rest of the family, NOT the insurance companies. Get the jab.
animecrazystyle
At the end of the day it's still not the rest of the families fault. With all the misinformation out there I can understand not wanting it.
mardukkur
It's not punishing anybody. You can't buy life insurance and commit suicide. That's not how it works.
FelixG
Covid has a super low mortality rate, its not even remotely comparable. People trying to take benefits away from others are scum.
mardukkur
People deliberately putting everyone around them at risk of death are not only scum but also not entitled to scam life insurance.
FelixG
No, they are idiots. They are trying to look after themselves even if they are ignorant. You are scum because you are wanting to 1/2
FelixG
maliciously punish someone for being ignorant and uneducated. Thats what makes you and the people that cheer this scum. 2/2
animecrazystyle
Thats a false equivalentcy. Stop.
mardukkur
Hardly.
animecrazystyle
Fully. Not getting vaxxed isn't the same as purposely killing yourself to get insurance money or just plain old suicide. Big ass difference
mardukkur
Yeah suicide doesn’t risk taking a bunch of innocent people down with you.
Fejerro
So you begged and pleaded with your dad to get vaccinated, he didn't and died of Covid, and now you don't get the life insurance and have to
AggroMonster
And who's fault is it that your idiot father refused? *yours*, by the way you speak.
PopcornPotatoe
I mean, plenty of us beg and plead with people to not drink and drive + speed, or do other risky shit that voids their insurance coverage...
ShoggothTree
Sounds like the dad cared more about being unvaccinated than providing for his family.
Fejerro
Yes, so let's hurt the family more with a policy that isn't going to convince the dad at all and will only benefit insurance companies.
ShoggothTree
It also benefits other people who are vaccinated and have that same insurance policy in regards to what rate they have to pay.
TakeTheStairs
thats not how that calculation works
ShoggothTree
A group's life table doesn't have an impact on their rates?
Fejerro
You think an insurance company is going to lower your rates when antivaxxers die? We're still paying 2008 airline fuel surcharges.
ShoggothTree
Do you understand how actuarial science and life insurance works? Higher percentages of deaths = higher insurance rates.
Fejerro
cover the funeral and everything that goes with it out of pocket yourself? This isn't hurting who you think it's hurting.
mardukkur
Who could possibly give the slightest flying fuck? Why would an insurance company pay out for some dipshit playing Russian roulette?
mardukkur
Sorry your dad was an asshole who tried to scam the life insurance company, kid. Pour les encourager les autres.
CrypticalEnvelopement
You can't drastically change your chances or mortality, then get angry when they revoke your mortality lottery ticket
CrypticalEnvelopement
Behavior cayagorozed by excessive risk is often exempted from insurance policies, this isn't as new or as vindictive as you think it is
Fejerro
It is vindictive as those who will suffer most are the ones who didn't make the choice not to get vaccinated. I understand the excessive
CrypticalEnvelopement
It's not vindictive because it's not unique to this one decision, put something that applies to all excessively risky decisions
Fejerro
This policy will lightly help insurance companies and catestrophically hurt families who were likely vaccinated themselves. It's bad.
Fejerro
risk, but this policy is going to hurt the wrong people. A widow who wanted their spouse to be vaccinated but they rufused is now saddled
Fejerro
with debt and will likely have to work the rest of their life without the life insurance payout. This hurts the wrong people, and that's bad
CuddlyPervert
This makes me nervous for the immunocompromised folks who can't get vaccinated...
AggroMonster
See “valid documented exception” https://www.thecity.nyc/2021/9/12/22667777/no-covid-death-benefit-for-unvaccinated-mta-bus-subway-workers
Causeitsmadeofmeat
If it's legit, they would not be risk-taking, therefore they would be covered
RealFakeUsername
Do keep in mind that this means the family, which might have been begging the person to get the vaccine, is now left in the dry.
RealFakeUsername
Don't be fooled into seeing this as karmic justice for the anti-vaxxer, as in reality they aren't the one suffering from this.
RealFakeUsername
I understand the push towards vaccination, and the justified anger at the selfishness of anti-vaxxers, but I struggle to celebrate over this
ferrelnm
This seems like an easy money-grab from insurance companies. While yes, wholly fuck the unvaccinated, this only hurts those left behind.
AggroMonster
If they aren't paying out on the death of the anti-vaxer, I really REALLY doubt the family is giving them any $. How do they grab on that?
AggroMonster
And this is NOT an insurance company. This is their employer, NY MTA. Read a bit, maybe??
ferrelnm
Fine, money-grab by the NY MTA. Point stands, only hurts the surviving family members. Focus a bit maybe?
taqPCR
The NY MTA had been considering Covid deaths on the job deaths. Now they're not if you're unvaccinated and they don't pay for other deaths.
SpiteLip
Car insurance won't payout if you're driving 125 mph with a BAC of 0.16 - same thing.
mikasaur
I... don't think that's true?
Bystandr
Not really as the death benefit represents a signed contract and while the worker is working (fulfilling their side) the terms shouldnt be
Bystandr
able to be changed without their consent. That said, Im 100% pro vax, I just see the issue with allowing one party to change a contract on
Bystandr
the fly without notice. If that worker does not consent, it should still obligate insurance to carry the policy for the duration of the term
Bystandr
agreed. While I agree insurance should be able to SET contracts with vaccination status in mind, they should not be able to change them on
Bystandr
the fly without consent, nor cancel existing policies before terms expire should the worker not consent to the change.
NegativelyPositive
Mine was 100 in a 45 w/ a BAC of .24. Needless to say, I was trying to kill myself.
jsng12
No, NOT the same thing. This just screws over their families.
ByTheGodsThisSucks
If the person is able to be vaccinated and isnt, they clearly didnt care about their family anyway
whatsisname
Yes, they absolutely will. That is the risk they take when they write a liability insurance policy. They won't insure you afterwards, but
whatsisname
they'll still have to cover the liabilities of that crash, that's why it's insurance. The only major exception is if they can prove you
tocooljim
False. My insurance policy says that it will not cover anything if the insured does so during a criminal act. Felonies are criminal.
whatsisname
You might want to read closer. Think about it, pretty much 99% of every car crash involves something that is technically illegal. If
whatsisname
coverage could be denied for virtually ever crash, there wouldn't be much point to it.
whatsisname
crashed as part of an insurance fraud scheme.
OddlyPacific
Life insurance won't payout for suicide
ThatShiftyMonkey
Mine does.
Forsaken64
Just get a death insurance instead. /sarcasm
tinyfootprints
Actually, it will. Not within 24 months of getting a policy, but after 24 months, most companies will pay. (Former salesman here)
ellgramar
This gives me hope for my future
OddlyPacific
Thanks for the tip! /s
Bonana
There are so many caveats to selling insurance... the policies are so thorough you'd think you're working for BBEG in a movie. Oh wait......
VC999999
100% correct. I worked in admin at a LICo, and processed many death benefits, many causes. Some plans had graded benefit within .....
VC999999
a certain timeframe of issue (non-underwritten plans typically), but I never had a suicide outside of 2yrs of issue be a contested claim.
Beezlebubble
Like on the dot or...
tinyfootprints
Down to the day. I've never heard of a situation where hours mattered on this one.
AnathemaNoreh
Where? Here if you are convicted of a crime* you will be denied lost wage coverage, but your medical and/or funeral benefits are guaranteed
AnathemaNoreh
no matter the circumstances of the accident. The drunk driver running the red light and the pedestrian he hits have the same coverage
AnathemaNoreh
*hit and run, or running from the cops are crimes. Speeding, DUI, and even "dangerous driving causing death" are just traffic infractions
Isorikk
You can be charged with manslaughter for causing death while driving, which is a felony.
Isorikk
Hell if they can prove it was pre-meditated or intentional, that's straight-up murder. Which, if you're somehow not aware, is also a felony.
AnathemaNoreh
If it was premeditated or intentional, yes that is a crime. I only mentioned dangerous driving causing death, which is a traffic offense
AnathemaNoreh
Yes, if that's the charge. I was saying that if you are charged with only "dangerous driving causing death" that's a highway traffic /
AnathemaNoreh
violation. The charge I named is different and why I specified that it is a traffic violation different from vehicular manslaughter.
Madhats9000
Henry Ruggs for those who are curious. Hes an American football player, or was
Lethous
And yes was, raiders cut him pretty fast.
Lethous
He was going 156 mph
NewToTheEnterwbs
Who killed a 23 year old woman and her dog. I truly hope she didn't burn to death.
Tminus1622d
So who paid out then? Did he pay? I kinda do feel like it's mostly the insurance company who gains here.
sesamesnapsinhalf
The news report said witnesses heard her screaming but couldn’t save her. So tragic.
NewToTheEnterwbs
I took a peek and looks like Ruggs and his female companion were the ones screaming. That the 23yr old was unresponsive.
sesamesnapsinhalf
What I read: https://www.reviewjournal.com/crime/the-morning-tina-tintor-and-raiders-star-henry-ruggs-crossed-paths-2471162/amp/
Tminus1622d
Also, judging by the car models and the photo's, this is anothe case of bumper mismatch. The cars did not do the bumper to bumper thingie>>
Tminus1622d
The sports car seemed to have gone under the Toyota RAV4. That might be why the car caught fire. We should really start pushing for>>
Tminus1622d
bumpers to be at the same height on cars, otherwise what's the fcking point?
lurksohardmotherfuckerswannafindme
If he hit her going that fast I REALLY hope it was instant. If not…Jesus fuck
SpiteLip
He rear-ended her and she was pinned in the car as it caught fire. The story is people heard her screaming.
ArgJargon
It was not. Her car caught on fire, and she was pinned in the drivers seat, people heard her screaming but the flames drove them back.
lurksohardmotherfuckerswannafindme
Fuccccccck
ArgJargon
Its really fucking sad.
jsng12
Are you insane!? Somebody doesn't get vaccinated and THEIR FAMILY gets punished for it!?
AggroMonster
Nawp. This is a benefit paid out to an employee by the NY MTA. The employees are aware. No vax, no benefit. Suck it up and get the jab.
jsng12
The $500k part was extremely weird, so I looked into it. The death benefit was put in place specifically for covid deaths before the 1/
jsng12
vaccine was available, in April 2020. It was an extension of an existing policy for the same sum if an employee died of a job-related 2/
jsng12
incident. As far as I can tell, the NY MTA is fully in their right to do this both legally and morally, but the oversimplified headline 3/
jsng12
sets what the majority of those aware of it will see as a precedent. That belief of this being precedent is dangerous. 4/4
jsng12
https://khn.org/news/article/unvaccinated-workers-death-benefits/
BearsDontCare
I dont agree with this, its a dangerous precedent.
AggroMonster
Really? Like not driving drunk? Like committing suicide? Like the 10k other things that will lose your life benefits?
HiMyNameIsKevinIHaveChangnesia
It’s already set though. If I get stoned and wrap my car around a tree I’m not getting an insurance payout bc I engaged in that behavior.
BearsDontCare
Difference is its an immediate direct action that can be considered nigh suicidal.
scuba7jb
Good. I fail to see any problem here.
whatsisname
No this is bullshit. Changing the terms of an insurance policy after it is signed is bad news. Anti-Vaxxers are shit but this is really bad.
qwertdeep
‘Merica, bringing back the whole punishment for your father’s sins in good old 2021 corporate fuck over style
AlwaysSleepDeprived
People unable to get vaccinated because the vaccine would kill them due to compromised health now being denied life insurance isn't?
shinythingsgood
Barriers to access to care and service are bad no matter who is the first target. They are not likely to be the last victim of new profits.
shinagami091
I kind of do. What if the rest of the family was responsible and just the one person didn’t and died? They lose out on the benefit money>
shinagami091
because the insured made a bad decision? Why should the family suffer with the inevitable expenses that death brings? Also sets a slippery>
shinagami091
slope for further denial payouts. What’s next? Denied because you ate nothing but fast food and didn’t work out?
[deleted]
[deleted]
KoolInternetCat
Have another, ya know, for variation
CrypticalEnvelopement
CrypticalEnvelopement
While we're at it, I'll share some more (directed at antivaxers, not you lol)
CrypticalEnvelopement
Another good reaction jpg
KoolInternetCat
Nice, thanks :)
Crawmak
Kinda sucks for the vaxxed people who have to deal with passing family though
shawberry
I'm all for insurance not covering their asses and loss of work, but I feel bad if a spouse got vaccinated but couldn't talk thier partner
shawberry
Into getting vaccinated. Especially if there are kids.
whooptydoo
exactly this. evereyone is an individual, others should not be FORCED to pay the price for anothers choices. exactly the reason were all pro
whooptydoo
vax...
PewPewPaw
Because I still would have to pay for the funeral. I still have expenses because they die. Their kids still need to live.
MrIndubitably101
If they are this stubborn to not get vaccinated just because they don't want to... they made that choice for you AND them.
TakeTheStairs
the problem is this punishes people who werent the cause of the problem. i am totally pro-vax and this is fucked up Merican capitalist shit
Tminus1622d
People who cant get vaccinated for medical reasons?
MrIndubitably101
Excused for medical reasons...as they are now. Hell they can go into a store unmasked during the height of the pandemic and claim medical...
MrIndubitably101
...exemption, though people that are so medically at risk that wearing a mask could hurt them... shouldn't be there in the first place.
AnathemaNoreh
By that logic smokers and the morbidly obese should be excluded. Yes raise their premiums, or lower their coverage, but denying seems harsh.
MrIndubitably101
Insurance companies already deny these people. If they find and discrepancies they deny coverage...this is nothing new.
whooptydoo
absolutley.
Encrux
You fail to see it? Well that's honestly impressive. Insurance now has a valid argument for future cuts. Smoking? Overweight? Lack of
MentionSignificant
A. This isn't health insurance, this is a death benefit from the employer. B. Most life insurance covers SUICIDE after a set period.
MentionSignificant
C. Smoking has already been making premiums more expensive for health insurance for decades. That ship has sailed.
Encrux
Better refuel that ship then, right?
MentionSignificant
What, exactly, would 'refueling' the ship even entail in this metaphor? And have you ever heard of the slippery slope fallacy?
Encrux
...exercise? Literally anything unhealthy? Good luck fighting for your insurance. That's one slippery slope.
EatsBees
Citibank employees who smoke pay higher insurance premiums than those who do not. i believe an extra $600/year. and they tell you upfront
whatsisname
Nobody has a problem with riskier behaviors incurring higher premiums, but it has to be up front and fixed once the policy is written.
whatsisname
If someone decides to become a smoker after they get an insurance policy, too bad so sad for the insurance company.
Encrux
Oh right, 'murica. I'm thinking about mandatory healthcare. My bad I guess
Arcygenical
... 500k? Is this a life insurance policy?
AggroMonster
No. It's courtesy of the NY MTA - their employer.
CrypticalEnvelopement
It's still a life policy, just one the employer pays for
CrypticalEnvelopement
Yes. I'm going to assume it's an AD&D policy, but it could be a straight up life insurance policy
LrrrRulerofThePlanetOmicronPerseiVIII
$500k will buy a lot of Advanced Dungeons and Dragons supplies!
CrypticalEnvelopement
Advanced Dungeons & Dragons is likely to result in lots of Accidental Death & Dismemberment ?
DukeDarkwood
You know, they claimed that a lot in the '80s, just to discourage people from playing it.
superbob201
I'm not too thrilled with it. This will hurt the people left behind, not the antivaxxers themselves, and benefit the insurance companies.
TheMeanGombeen
Insurance is based on the calculation of risk. The more risk, the higher the premium.
unohowibe
I believe my dude is not trying to discount the positive impact of this but simply pointing out that survivors will be hurt.
VodkaReindeer
People in risk of being left behind need to apply some peer pressure.
rlrobles5
Well, selfishness and stupidity hurt others by definition.
mrbellek
Agreed. This is pretty scummy of the insurance companies.
thatfucknguy
Insurance is scummy to begin with. Biggest scam in America. Having said that, maybe the people at risk of losing out should do something to
thatfucknguy
convince their loved one to *not* fuck them over financially AND emotionally by choosing to not get vax'd and die of covid?
Maitrify
I concur. I'm really torn on it. On one hand, they should get vaccinated. On the other, extended family who ARE vax'd will be hurt. =/
Iloveanonymityandilovebeingnoticed
Not paying out if you die driving drunk, or die by suicide also hurts the people left behind and people don’t complain about that.
CrypticalEnvelopement
Excessively risky behavior isn't covered by insurance, and if they won't care about strangers maybe they'll at least care about their family
unluckyandbored
If they cared about their family, they'd have gotten vaxxed
qwertdeep
Haven’t their families already suffered enough for their selfish ass? I swear imgur wouldn’t have sympathy if they started kulling the/
qwertdeep
Antivaxxers
bamcobra
If they don’t care enough about their families to help protect them, don’t blame the insurance companies or employers.
bamcobra
Sorry OP. That comment was intended for Superbob. Not disagreeing with you at all.
skyconb
They should obviously be vaccinated. But as someone who knows unvaccinated people. They genuinely think covid vaccines are harmful. And 1/
skyconb
they are often some of the kindest people I know. Very caring mothers who think more with their emotions than with logic are the main 2/
skyconb
demographic of vaccine doubters. They have been targeted by very successful propaganda that exploits their caring personality to sell 3/
skyconb
alternative medication. Most unvaccinated people are victims of a malicious propaganda network that is designed to milk them for money. 4/
whooptydoo
but what if they dont. then youre just fucking the family for choices they didnt make. i would never support insurance not paying death
whooptydoo
benefits to a family who lost somebody to smoking, or not wearing their seatbelt.
Spiderbutts
Agree. The spouse and kids shouldn't go into debt because the deceased was a dipshit. It's punishing the wrong people.
whooptydoo
yes. and to anyone thinking "shouldnt have assosiated with them", just remeber how complex people are. its never as simple as being a pos or
AnathemaNoreh
It's covered, in insurance school they remind us that "stupid" is covered. Most people just really underestimate costs. Funeral benefits /
AnathemaNoreh
are "covered", but the standard policy maximum is $6k+tax, way too low for most actual services. You buy travel insurance because you're/
AnathemaNoreh
cautious, guess what it has a $50k limit and air ambulances aren't covered so that dirt bike ride on vacation that resulted in a month stay/
AnathemaNoreh
at a Mexican hospital including surgeries and air lift home once you're stable is $500k over your limit that you have to pay. Never assume
starsilver13
The problem is defining “risky” boundaries. From a legal standpoint it’s slippery slope and mostly benefits insurance corps over insured
evilspock
This will compel *many many* antivaxxers to get vaccinated anyway, and save lives. Most antivaxers are full of shit and seeking attention.
AnathemaNoreh
I think more likely struggling family will lye about vaccinations. It's not like they believe they could die from it anyways
evilspock
Many will - but the insurance companies will ask for proof, and at a more stringent level than others. Money is on the line.
WoeToHice
Unfortunately, people who are full of shit and seeking attention have been shown that they can keep getting attention by doubling down.
evilspock
Then they pay the penalty, or their family does.
WoeToHice
Yes, but that also gives them more reasons to claim victimhood, which the far right uses to radicalize them. What I'm trying to say is (1/3)
WoeToHice
that measures like these aren't enough anymore to combat the antivaxxer idiocy. As long as those who use antivaxxers as their (2/3)
Fejerro
This will compel maybe 1 antivaxxer to get vaccinated, and leave many majority vaccinated families in extreme financial hardship.
evilspock
Except of many hundreds of NYC cops who were unvaccinated, when push came to shove only 34 had the balls to openly refuse. Anti-vax is talk
prettybigguy
No, if you threaten their wallets it will get them vaccinated. It's why less than 1% of cops and other workers actually quit
xL0opx
look, there was a german town that started to offer a free Bratwurst if you get vaccinated. One (1) Sausage. Tons of people showed up.
Dashirl
Life insurance doesn't pay if someone kills themselves. Seems pretty similar. And of course as has been noted about risky behavior
r6popo
They do if suicide takes place 2 years after the policy is purchased
whatsisname
Only really shitty policies that only exist because some states are too gutless to require it. All decent policies pay out on suicides after
Dashirl
Really? I've been thinking about this since I posted. The more I think about it the more I think insurance SHOULD pay out for suicide and 1/
Dashirl
Death due to risky behavior. In the drunk driving example, fine, don't pay out for the drunk driver's car. But pay the victims. Pay the 2/
Dashirl
Family life insurance if the driver dies. We should never punish the survivors for the bad actions of the dead. 3/3
whatsisname
a couple of years. Most policies in the good states after something like 5 years can only refuse to pay out for failure to pay premiums.