They are scared of him because all the times they cried " we can't do that, it's too hard, too expensive, risky" They are terrified that what he's doing is going to work.
Having worked in a supermarket several years ago and also being raised in a family with a general store, supermarkets do indeed operate in principle on a high volume low margin basis. That does not mean however that abuse can exist, especially by the producers and middle-men, not necessarily the stores themselves, except maybe in the case of Walmart etc.
Having a cheap, municipal alternative is great. The US Postal Service has been a pain in the ass for FedEx and UPS who can't collude to set prices higher, because the government will always undercut them. Unless Republicans get control and demand stupid shit to bankrupt USPS like making them fund their pension program until the heat-death of the universe (and somehow, USPS was well-run enough that it was able to meet their sabotaging demands).
Although I don't doubt big grocery is greedy. These numbers of 30% need a year or two to bake and get accurate. Food fluctuates in cost, in some cases widely, through the year.
This is one of the reasons why private corporations attempt to crush any kind of public option. As soon as one is available, it shows how much the private sector is bilking everyone, and people start demanding more public options.
Yup. Reminds me of when cities were fed up with the telecom price gouging and some cities started setting up municipal broadband networks. Comcast and friends ran straight to the state legislatures and lobbied hard to ban that, and it is now banned in 16 states (all of those bans ghost written by their regional telecoms).
Fox News has been trying and failing to start a Red Scare, because all they have to show is him actually being a good guy and they can't spin it hard enough
Seeing my dad over the weekend, and he's at the "rant at everything" stage. I'm fully expecting an argument along the lines of, "FD, you're single. How would you feel about your taxes going to feed a family of 6 you don't know?"
I'm fine with it. I'd rather that family be able to give their kids a piece of fruit, some proper toast, and a glass of milk for breakfast over poptarts, because the poptarts were all they could afford before.
I wouldn't be quite as bothered by the high prices at the grocery store if that was passed on to the people actually grow the food. But I know farmers in my Province and the money they get from wholesalers is nearly the same as it was 10 years ago. Whereas their costs for fertilizer labor Etc has gone up sharply
The guy went to school for us the CEO of a major drugstore chain here in Western canada. He has the nerve to go on television saying that his store is a victim of all these poor people stealing stuff. I heard first time from my wife how things are running their store because she worked there for several years
I hope, for the love of god and humanity, that Mamdani doesn't have any skeletons in his closet that will derail all this momentum and good will. For all mankind.
I agree there's price gouging because it's fairly obvious but this isn't proof of anything. These stores are likely going to operate at a loss and a regular grocery store isn't going to do that nor should it.
Listen... if you're addicted to soda and willing to pay 12$ a case for it... and people that aren't addicted are only willing to pay $4 a case... won't you think of the shareholders?? How else are they supposed to extract maximum money from people while changing nothing about their products??
The funniest part about this is that all the republican campaign promises, even some of trumps to make the cost of loving go down instead of up through his policies. All those promises and more are being realized in NY by their sworn enemy, Mamdani the socialist democrat. Fucking hilarious keep it going Mamdani and NY please keep this guy SAFE.
I wish I worked at my old job with my horribly toxic coworker because it would be fun to watch him melt down about Mamdani. But more importantly, I wish I worked at my old job and he wasn't there because I really liked working there. Except for him. And the pay. So I wish I worked there and got paid better and he wasn't there. Damn, if wishes were horses beggars really would ride.
Not just media. Even people in general. Everyone is acting skeptical because everyone is worried this will hurt smaller businesses. Instead of going. If a city run store can maybe its the whole system that's ducked and we need to fix it for everyone, including the small businesses. Which means forcing everyone in the whole chain of production and distribution to stop price gouging themselves, and small businesses could afford stuff again. (I've worked in food/beverage retail/dist for 10+yrs)
as fare as I read now I can be wrong is the idea that the stores will be built with tax payers money and then are run with no tax or rent and that is why they can give the 30% off as there are almost no costs involved . now correct me if i heard that wrong ?
They will be built with city budget(tax money) as is any public service. Why we pay taxes (and why the rich need to pay a ton more) They will still get taxed and tax on sales. But get help from city when it comes to a difference in loss from discounted items. And won't have fluctuating prices. Just one set price a month. (This actually helps as funny as it sounds). Also, only spec items get this discount. The rent is free because it'll be a state owned building and they won't care to get rent.
That is the story of the other grocery stores are telling. What is being counter asserted is that it's actually the obscene profits that are causing the higher prices, and a low / no profit grocery store will demonstrate that.
Would be cool to do this with an airline. One gov funded "public transportation" airline not designed to turn a profit. Set a standard fair fare to keep other 'luxury' airlines from price gouging. Oh, and more trains. Hey, an old woman can dream
All retail just looks for a reason to increase costs. Grocery stores do it, the food manufacturers do it. They all claim its due to inflation and supply but turn around and post record profits, highest ever. Costs go up 10%, they increase the price by 20%. Then when inflation dips, they decrease the cost 5%. They will never go back to the prices before even if the costs do and people will be happy they saw their bill drop 5% instead of 20%.
So thr city sells an orange at 70 cents instead of a dollar. But the child does not get scurvy so the low income family does not incur healthcare costs paid for by taxes. The low income child is no longer hungry before school and becomes more invested in education and less likely to commit crime saving the tax payers money in incarceration costs. Well fed kids dont become pirates
If you give the people the money, they will continue to be paying high costs, and the rich will just get that money in a week or two anyway. If you run the store, the people don't have to pay those costs and anymore, and they can get more food for their families.
It likely helps ensure that grocery stores don't all immediately raise their prices as they salivate about the thought of extracting additional profit from the hides of the people.
We've seen it time and again that if people have more money, corpos start thinking "how can we take it away from them as fast as possible while providing as little as possible in return so as to generate value for shareholders"
Discounting at 30% ensures that the savings goes directly to the consumer. A check doesn’t always ensure that, and likely includes a bunch of red tape.
Grocery stores literally don't carry anything that isn't subsidized if the markup is less than 15%, most things are closer to 50% markup, and anything in the pharmacy the markup starts at 1000%.
I am pretty sure, that every one of these stores will operate at a loss. Because profit margins of ~30% just seem impossible. I worked in food industry analytics in Finland 20 years ago, so I have (maybe outdated) view of how things work. But then again, this can be seen as a service, that benefits the communities around the stores. Just put those stores in poor areas and grocery deserts. I would pay for those from my taxes. But I have my doubts about success of this venture..
First, they’re not making these stores pay any taxes. Massive burden. Second, they’ll lose money intentionally as it’s tax payer subsidized. They’re not making a more efficient store. It’s not talent or a miracle, it’s using the monopoly on force to seize $ to blow on neo bread lines.
Argued with someone about the plan to mandate discounts for self checkout only for some dumbass to argue "yOu aRe nOt eNtItLeD tO mOnEy mAdE bY iNnOvAtIoN!" and sure... but it isn't innovation its putting the job of cashier on the customer. If they save so much money that means the cost of doing business went down and they think its fine that 0% is passed along to consumers (though cost increases always are.) And that's before wage theft that got them all that "investment" money to begin with.
Also. Every corporation on earth will fight for a taste of your innovation savings come contract renewal time. "It cost less labor hours to make cookies now that you put machines in place, they should be cheaper". At the minimum they will fight any price increase next contract season
That’s flipping the idea of innovation on its head. Innovation since the invention of the wheel has been to make daily life easier.
Thinking of it as a lever to maximize the ease of daily life solely for the people who made it isn’t just capitalism, it’s a feudalist system for invention and functional access hoarding.
We have companies racing to automate labor for their benefit, while hoarding and redefining access to paid labor itself.
I work in IT for a company that sells these machines. It does definitely save some wages by having self checkout but there are a few more considerations. There is a pretty high failure rate on a self checkout and many stores have to keep fairly expensive contracts with POS support companies in order to make sure the machines keep running. I actually have to work on cloning one that had a drive die later today. Not really trying to be devil's advocate but I do have industry info on this.
But it doesn't require breaks, sick days or health benefits like an actual employee. Less employees means less managers to watch over them. Less uniforms and name tags to buy. Less space required for employees to store personal items and take breaks. And it can't sue you for lost wages, job injuries, discrimination, etc. Ultimately, it costs them a lot less even factoring in IT costs.
I saw flop news just relentlessly attempting to trash this guy yesterday. It would have been funny, the hysteria and fear mongering they were so obviously trying to sow, except that I know there are those that are just lapping it up. Not one word about the illiterate moron’s corruption, pedophilia, stupid illegal wars, etc.
"For that kind of money, they could buy everyone in NYC Costco memberships."
Yeah, sure lets make the most food-insecure New Yorkers travel to 1 of 3 Costcos actually in city limits (only in Brooklyn, Queens, and Staten Island, by the way)
This is price pinning made politic. You know your avg viewer shops at costco so you make the fact of membership price "match" policy cost to make your viewer equate the two regardless of relevance. Simple and effective marketing. (Read, evil cunty shit smearing)
Are goods cheaper at Costco or Sam's Club or other bulk buy stores? Sure, per item, but you have to buy in bulk. That means you have to have the money to get more at a time. And the entire point is that so many people don't have enough money to buy a week of groceries, so how can they suddenly afford a month's worth just because you gave them a free membership?
Yup. The boots theory can apply here, as it's still "spend more now to save money in the long run." Even if some people would argue that that's specifically about quality, I say it amounts to the same general concept.
yep and also if your not a 4+ family most of the bulk goods are sort of hard to consume up before they go bad. and if you do manage its probebly becuase you been eating nothing but X for a month for 2 out of 3 meals out of that.
If they're selling 30% below market, how do they prevent scalpers from buying all of it up on the 1st of the month and then re-selling it at market price?
Broken ankles, I know a guy named Sal that does honest work that could help. Or just let the folks in the parking lot know who is literally taking food from their children's mouths. System should 'self correct' at that point. You can hose down the parking lot later.
Also, it's literally pointless. You'd have to sell it at more than the store price. Which means you'd be selling it at more than wholesale price. Which means all you did is open a grocery store with an extra middle man eating into your profits XD
Would you buy produce and meats off your neighbor? I don't know how you can scalp perishables. I'm not sure who you are expecting to do the actual scalping. ( Not that I disagree people will probably find a way)
They'll buy seafood out of the back of a truck from a cooler 5 hours inland from the Gulf of Mexico. They would absolutely buy produce and meat from a neighbor.
Set some stock out every day like a normal grocery store? You're not gonna be getting fresh stuff like that in once a month anyway. Most stores are going to be restocking every morning and then throughout the day, so it's not like the guy who's first in line on the first of the month is going to clean them out for more than maybe 24h max. Plus enforce the existing licensing laws for selling food.
He addressed it during the speech. The idea is to use a card system, so they can track purchases. Also, it's only for staples, so they expire quickly. No one should be buying up all the milk and bread, as they are not able to on-sell them before they spoil. Canned goods like fruit and baby formula might be an issue though.
Reselling where? Like you load your truck with bread and bannanas where do you go to sell it? First off it's probably illegal for you to sell produce from your truck, but secondly who's going to buy it? Becuase if you're selling for market price I'd rather just go to a market then get it from some dude. And if any of it doesn't sell that's money from your pocket, it's perishable it's not like a funko pop where you can keep it in a closet
Idk what they have planned. But some US military commissaries overseas have rations, or a cap, on how much you can spend per month to specifically combat scalpers from buying on base and then selling it off base.
It would be pretty obvious if someone was trying to buy up so much stuff not for themselves. And where would the scalper sell? Would you buy milk at grocery store price from a guy on the sidewalk?
Bodegas around here do this all the time, they buy milk or whatever from the grocery store a few minutes drive down the street and then resell it at their bodega at a higher price. If they can get it even cheaper than the grocery store and then sell it for a profit while still being cheaper than the grocery store, you bet your ass they'll buy up as much as they can.
I know my bodega does this but sometimes I need milk, cheese, butter, bread, etc for tonight's meal and don't have time to run to the grocery store. I'm paying for the convenience. Plus the bodega owner is a small business owner, pays his employees a fair living wage and all of them are a valued part of our community/neighborhood.
In my experience, it's a local, family owned place. I've worked both bullseye and wally world, and you'd know it's a reseller because they'd want an entire skid's worth of milk, chocolate milk, or soda (especially if there's a really good sale) and they'd use a really stupid excuse like 'I need 80 cases of mountain dew and pepsi 'cos we're having a party'
Okay? So just tell the managers/cashiers of this city-run store to not sell bulk. Set low item limits per person and ban people who abuse the system.
Better yet, make it explicitly fraud and hit them with massive fines and/or jail time for doing it.
Someone's always gonna try it anyway, but if you make it inconvenient to do and make an example out of anyone you catch doing it, very few people will. So long as enough's left for everyone who needs it, that's good enough.
If there wasn't any left in the store, and it was 10% less than a regular grocery store? And yes it would be obvious if someone was buying in bulk to re-sell. But that's also been obvious before, like with GPUs or with toilet paper during Covid or bottled water during a hurricane/flood etc. Nobody stopped those people. I'm just saying, people will try this, there better be a plan in place to prevent it.
I'd say that issue is probably something they'd prefer to tackle in this scenario, as the point isn't just to "sell" the product, it's to make it affordable and available to people. In those scalper scenarios, the purpose wasn't to make it affordable and available, but just to sell it. So why would the retail stores care if it's a scalper buying? It's bought with the same money, and then it's not their problem to deal with.
Actually they would care - scalping means the price gouging opportunity wasn't fully realized. It might be that prices are set centrally by corporate market researchers, and they think it's not worth it to adjust at every store, or something. But some overpaid office drone definitely made a powerpoint on the subject.
These are not private corporations that don't care who buys as long as the money flows. It's literally 5 city-run stores with a very specific purpose. They can say no to a person who buys a metric ton of meat, or all of the apples.
"Can they though?" That's doubt without any validity. Arguments people. Support your opinions, doubts, etc with valid arguments. You can't doubt something and then just Skeletor away.
Supermarkets constantly claim that they have a profit margin of only 2%, which is not at all what you will find when you check out the data you can find by checking out their websites or in their shareholders' reports.
That may be somewhat true at final sale at the retail level, the thing is that most big grocery chains own the entire vertical from production, through logistics, then wholesale, and finally retail. They take their cut at each step of the process so the final end to end profit margin is way more than 2%.
Item markup is not pure business profit, it also has to be used to cover operational costs. Costco makes a big portion of their money off the membership, not item markup, which is a big why their markup is low (along with bulk sales efficiency)
I'm jealous because my mom's town has a WinCo (employee-owned company) and they're consistently way cheaper than the major grocery stores where I live, which are of course all publicly traded companies.
Utter codswallop. My local store has rotating sales where you use an app and scan the sale tags. They are routinely 30-50% off or more. The store isn’t losing money on this stuff. It just illustrates how badly they’re gouging on their regular prices.
I feel like a lot of places claim "razor thin margins" and it just doesn't make sense, otherwise it wouldn't be profitable to open.
I feel like a lot of the stats that create this claim are based on the fact that (a) many people start these businesses without any business sense/experience or (b) over saturation of the business resulting in smaller clientele.
But seriously, I don't doubt that the big name companies/businesses are doing that and just feigning "razor thin margins" (as the other guy said, likely mention profits AFTER they take a big cut). I'm just referring to all the small owners who decided to get into the restaurant business for easy cash without any clue what to do (regardless of validity, I'm thinking of the cases like in Kitchen Nightmare with Gordon Ramsey)
Margin calculates after including labor cost, so really what it means is: 'executives calculated the profit, extracted 98% to pay themselves & shareholders, and left a 'razor thin' residual for the business to remain 'profitable' despite 'facing challenges'.'
LMFAO...I worked in grocery store for 15 yrs...typically (at that time anyway) it was 25%, and you did it by taking cost divide by .75, not cost X 1.25 so your profit of 25% was 25% of the retail price (it makes sense if you know - you know). 2% my fat ass...and yes, wages and all that have to come out of that but if they are passing off "2%" they're full of shit. And I made more than double/hr 35+ yrs ago than what the US min wage is today. (also WTF!?)
Also their shoplifting crisis is manufactured by counting all sources or inventory adjustment, including defective returns, recalls, expired food, shipping discrepancies, store use, etc etc etc
Yes and not just american stores do this bullshit, experiencing 30% more expensive prices and the stores claiming its because of inflation and then a year later reporting record profits is apparantly a swedish thing too.
There’s a difference between what the corporations and what the actual store owners make. I’ve worked in the grocery industry and, at store level, margins (in Canada, anyway) are not amazing. However, the corporation that owns the banners (ie. National Grocers, also known as Loblaw Companies) make great money. NG sells its franchises to independent owners who operate stores. They also wholesale the goods to those stores. They also set the pricing those stores must follow. They control everything
Sorry for double comment. To clarify, vendors pay that to the corporations, not the stores. Again, there’s a difference between store level and corporate level. Stores aren’t benefiting from that money, the corporation is.
Ontario Teacher's Pension Fund and McCain foods (maple leaf foods, etc) don't help at all, everyone is fine with massive profits for HUMAN ESSENTIALS all the way up to government.
Supermarkets definitely don't, but New York is famous for having a ton of small, local bodegas and family run grocers that do run on razor thin margins. It's up in the air how this will affect them.
It's 1 store per borough. This won't impact bodegas citywide. And right now this grocery (and its prices) mostly exist as press releases. We'll see how many actually open, what prices are actually like, how much we subsidize it over time, whether the store is any good. City-owned stores in other cities have been kinda shitty. So yeah, up in the air in all kinds of ways. I'm rooting for it to be awesome but I am super skeptical this will improve food security for significant numbers of people.
Specifically these are supposed to be opening in "food deserts" which already have a lower presence of food / grocery sellers, and the new stores won't have butchers, a deli, or sell lottery tickets to leave space for other stores. (Also, aside from the lottery tickets, I imagine those are an added expense to set up and maintain over just standard shelving and some freezer units.)
Yeah they are definitely added expense. At local grocery stores around here the deli counter is usually 15-30 feet long, depending on if they just do meat/cheese or if they also do potato/pasta salads, hot food items, etc. The deli cases are built more for display than storage, so they fit maybe 1/3 of what a normal waist-high shelf can hold. Plus you have the work area behind the counter (10-20 ft), dedicated deli staff, and expensive food prep equipment.
That's a lot of space being used, mostly just to give the illusion that you're getting fresh food. The hot food items? In a freezer in the back, then blasted in a convection oven or microwave (I forgot to account for the fridge/freezer in the back of the deli as additional space and cost in my first comment). Potato salad? Shipped on a truck in giant container, right next to the individual containers of the same stuff.
The meat and cheese is another story, generally a full ham or hunk of cheese ships better than pre-sliced. But that could still be handled on site, just with workers prepping it and putting out a bunch in the morning and refilling sold stock a couple times per day. 2 slicers, 1 scale, and a fridge that's 1/5 the size of the current fridge.
Yeah some people would bitch because they can't request their preferred thickness, but even that could be accommodated pretty easily while saving space/money
RedSkizzers
Oldiewankenobie1
Theyre gonna have him killed...
MunsterZero
I surely hope he has bodyguards for that.
iamthemurray
They are scared of him because all the times they cried " we can't do that, it's too hard, too expensive, risky" They are terrified that what he's doing is going to work.
kit99aLucentum
Having worked in a supermarket several years ago and also being raised in a family with a general store, supermarkets do indeed operate in principle on a high volume low margin basis. That does not mean however that abuse can exist, especially by the producers and middle-men, not necessarily the stores themselves, except maybe in the case of Walmart etc.
VikingsAreNinjaPirates
Having a cheap, municipal alternative is great. The US Postal Service has been a pain in the ass for FedEx and UPS who can't collude to set prices higher, because the government will always undercut them. Unless Republicans get control and demand stupid shit to bankrupt USPS like making them fund their pension program until the heat-death of the universe (and somehow, USPS was well-run enough that it was able to meet their sabotaging demands).
thedill2000
Although I don't doubt big grocery is greedy. These numbers of 30% need a year or two to bake and get accurate. Food fluctuates in cost, in some cases widely, through the year.
Vaevictus
This is one of the reasons why private corporations attempt to crush any kind of public option. As soon as one is available, it shows how much the private sector is bilking everyone, and people start demanding more public options.
euphxenos
Yup. Reminds me of when cities were fed up with the telecom price gouging and some cities started setting up municipal broadband networks. Comcast and friends ran straight to the state legislatures and lobbied hard to ban that, and it is now banned in 16 states (all of those bans ghost written by their regional telecoms).
SiameseDream
Exactly. ISPs = utilities plain and simple.
Cosmicfisherman
When one sows good and creates healthy happy citizens. One will reap great rewards.
QuartzPoker
Fox News has been trying and failing to start a Red Scare, because all they have to show is him actually being a good guy and they can't spin it hard enough
freakdiablo
Seeing my dad over the weekend, and he's at the "rant at everything" stage. I'm fully expecting an argument along the lines of, "FD, you're single. How would you feel about your taxes going to feed a family of 6 you don't know?"
I'm fine with it. I'd rather that family be able to give their kids a piece of fruit, some proper toast, and a glass of milk for breakfast over poptarts, because the poptarts were all they could afford before.
Cookiesnm1lk
is... is he not aware of how social security works?
JeffDanson
He just keeps delivering!
sochilln
Meanwhile in the White House...
https://media3.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPWE1NzM3M2U1dDZjZnM3ZHJxb2sweDdheG5lcnl0NDFmOWs4NnQ3MHI3aXBicWl6dSZlcD12MV9naWZzX3NlYXJjaCZjdD1n/Wvo6vaUsQa3Di/200w.webp
thatwoodguy
I wouldn't be quite as bothered by the high prices at the grocery store if that was passed on to the people actually grow the food. But I know farmers in my Province and the money they get from wholesalers is nearly the same as it was 10 years ago. Whereas their costs for fertilizer labor Etc has gone up sharply
Cookiesnm1lk
"keep prices THE SAME OR EVEN LOWER THEM? how will we afford those several hundred thousand dollar CEO bonuses if we do that?"
thatwoodguy
The guy went to school for us the CEO of a major drugstore chain here in Western canada. He has the nerve to go on television saying that his store is a victim of all these poor people stealing stuff. I heard first time from my wife how things are running their store because she worked there for several years
ExitThroughThePanaderia
I hope, for the love of god and humanity, that Mamdani doesn't have any skeletons in his closet that will derail all this momentum and good will. For all mankind.
Frobizzle
I agree there's price gouging because it's fairly obvious but this isn't proof of anything. These stores are likely going to operate at a loss and a regular grocery store isn't going to do that nor should it.
j4gr
What’s going to stop the bodegas from buying there and reselling?
mikeatike
They if they charge more than the neighborhood grocery store, thye wont compete?
Gotcha44
Can he please be cloned and installed in every seat of every government on the entire planet, pretty please with a cherry on top?
Cookiesnm1lk
with any luck, a radical solution like that won't be needed. with any luck there are more people like him and they'll get into office.
mygodhasabiggerdick
Im still gobsmacked at the idea of 'Dynamic Pricing' because...what the actual fuck?
unluckyandbored
Extract as much money as possible from the serfs so the ruling class can buy more yachts and luxury real estate.
GoneThenBackAgain
Listen... if you're addicted to soda and willing to pay 12$ a case for it... and people that aren't addicted are only willing to pay $4 a case... won't you think of the shareholders?? How else are they supposed to extract maximum money from people while changing nothing about their products??
Camelspotting
There are few terms worse than "what the market will bear."
Bystandr
Well its like this; you search for the item on your phone or mention it in conversation then your AI Palantir linked data center notices
Bystandr
you going to the grocery store and that store can jack the price of the things you are going to get. Step 3: PROFIT !
ideasbychuck
If the military can do it, cities and states should be able to do it too.
Commissary & On-Base Savings Calculator 2026 | Garrison Ledger https://share.google/8hyWMRRwg4JQMfYNx
CommanderWes
The funniest part about this is that all the republican campaign promises, even some of trumps to make the cost of loving go down instead of up through his policies. All those promises and more are being realized in NY by their sworn enemy, Mamdani the socialist democrat. Fucking hilarious keep it going Mamdani and NY please keep this guy SAFE.
JasonThorn
...the cost of loving? Your Freudian slip is showing. (j/k)
GanjalfTheClear
Mamdani: We're implementing ideas intended to help people and make society better for everyone, not just the rich.
Spineless Media: You're a dirty commie!
Idontneedrealfacts
RUDE!! he i a very clean commie
Snooj
I wish I worked at my old job with my horribly toxic coworker because it would be fun to watch him melt down about Mamdani. But more importantly, I wish I worked at my old job and he wasn't there because I really liked working there. Except for him. And the pay. So I wish I worked there and got paid better and he wasn't there. Damn, if wishes were horses beggars really would ride.
ImAGrower
Not just media. Even people in general. Everyone is acting skeptical because everyone is worried this will hurt smaller businesses. Instead of going. If a city run store can maybe its the whole system that's ducked and we need to fix it for everyone, including the small businesses. Which means forcing everyone in the whole chain of production and distribution to stop price gouging themselves, and small businesses could afford stuff again. (I've worked in food/beverage retail/dist for 10+yrs)
LinemanMatt
Yeah, those complaining that it will hurt Small Business will follow that up by going to shop at Walmart.
Unfortunately that's my parents.
ImAGrower
And the tax free part would be because it's a state owned building they will get rent-free, the state will also forego the land/property tax.
Lynkfox
If there were taxes they'd pay them to themselves to fund themselves.... Doesn't make much sense does it? 😆
nicilaskin
as fare as I read now I can be wrong is the idea that the stores will be built with tax payers money and then are run with no tax or rent and that is why they can give the 30% off as there are almost no costs involved . now correct me if i heard that wrong ?
ImAGrower
They will be built with city budget(tax money) as is any public service. Why we pay taxes (and why the rich need to pay a ton more) They will still get taxed and tax on sales. But get help from city when it comes to a difference in loss from discounted items. And won't have fluctuating prices. Just one set price a month. (This actually helps as funny as it sounds). Also, only spec items get this discount. The rent is free because it'll be a state owned building and they won't care to get rent.
Einstein9073
That is the story of the other grocery stores are telling.
What is being counter asserted is that it's actually the obscene profits that are causing the higher prices, and a low / no profit grocery store will demonstrate that.
Time will tell.
stltim
The military commissary model proved gouging was optional decades ago.
Smartbutnotreally
I genuinely fear for this man's life.. He's doing so many awesomely good things that I'm afraid someone is going to JFK him..
DVSBSTrD
@OP Almost like there are certain services only the government should be allowed to provide. Crazy isn't it?
Felderburg
...are you suggesting only the government should provide food?
DVSBSTrD
I'm suggesting that only the government can.
Felderburg
In what way? I am genuinely curious here.
DVSBSTrD
Because that's the only way food isn't held hostage by profit.
iusedtodream
Would be cool to do this with an airline. One gov funded "public transportation" airline not designed to turn a profit. Set a standard fair fare to keep other 'luxury' airlines from price gouging. Oh, and more trains. Hey, an old woman can dream
Felderburg
He looks a lot more tired than I previously recall.
thisisnotfineffs
Not surprising, him and his admin are working their fucking asses off for the working class, fucking amazing
TheDildoOfConsequences
Remember how Obama's hair turned from dark to grey while he was in office. Good administrators don't have an easy life.
OhIfIMust
The parasite class demands maximum profits.
xj4low
All retail just looks for a reason to increase costs. Grocery stores do it, the food manufacturers do it. They all claim its due to inflation and supply but turn around and post record profits, highest ever. Costs go up 10%, they increase the price by 20%. Then when inflation dips, they decrease the cost 5%. They will never go back to the prices before even if the costs do and people will be happy they saw their bill drop 5% instead of 20%.
svga
I mean... can't we just give the people in need the $100M dollars it is going to cost to build the stores to them directly?
https://www.forbes.com/sites/nathangoldman/2026/07/28/do-mamdanis-city-run-grocery-stores-break-economics-101/
SerpentorOfCobra
Snippet is correct the grocery store made shit profit but the supplier for that store makes all the profit.
selfishsarah
So thr city sells an orange at 70 cents instead of a dollar. But the child does not get scurvy so the low income family does not incur healthcare costs paid for by taxes. The low income child is no longer hungry before school and becomes more invested in education and less likely to commit crime saving the tax payers money in incarceration costs. Well fed kids dont become pirates
ThrowAwayAcct0000
If you give the people the money, they will continue to be paying high costs, and the rich will just get that money in a week or two anyway. If you run the store, the people don't have to pay those costs and anymore, and they can get more food for their families.
Daliena06
It likely helps ensure that grocery stores don't all immediately raise their prices as they salivate about the thought of extracting additional profit from the hides of the people.
We've seen it time and again that if people have more money, corpos start thinking "how can we take it away from them as fast as possible while providing as little as possible in return so as to generate value for shareholders"
nosadpandas
Discounting at 30% ensures that the savings goes directly to the consumer. A check doesn’t always ensure that, and likely includes a bunch of red tape.
akafluffy
Grocery stores don't operate on 1-3% profits on goods sold, who the fuck is lying to your stupid face like that that you'd repeat that bullshit.
EvilMandrid
Thanks, I needed that comment/laugh today
akafluffy
Grocery stores literally don't carry anything that isn't subsidized if the markup is less than 15%, most things are closer to 50% markup, and anything in the pharmacy the markup starts at 1000%.
hsalonen3000
I am pretty sure, that every one of these stores will operate at a loss. Because profit margins of ~30% just seem impossible. I worked in food industry analytics in Finland 20 years ago, so I have (maybe outdated) view of how things work.
But then again, this can be seen as a service, that benefits the communities around the stores. Just put those stores in poor areas and grocery deserts. I would pay for those from my taxes.
But I have my doubts about success of this venture..
ThotsAndPrayers
First, they’re not making these stores pay any taxes. Massive burden. Second, they’ll lose money intentionally as it’s tax payer subsidized. They’re not making a more efficient store.
It’s not talent or a miracle, it’s using the monopoly on force to seize $ to blow on neo bread lines.
YouRadicalizedMe
I fucking love this man!! You see we could have been doing this all along!! Fuck corporations!
IMakeLotsOfReferencesAndRemakes
Argued with someone about the plan to mandate discounts for self checkout only for some dumbass to argue "yOu aRe nOt eNtItLeD tO mOnEy mAdE bY iNnOvAtIoN!" and sure... but it isn't innovation its putting the job of cashier on the customer. If they save so much money that means the cost of doing business went down and they think its fine that 0% is passed along to consumers (though cost increases always are.) And that's before wage theft that got them all that "investment" money to begin with.
SarcasticComment
Also. Every corporation on earth will fight for a taste of your innovation savings come contract renewal time. "It cost less labor hours to make cookies now that you put machines in place, they should be cheaper". At the minimum they will fight any price increase next contract season
Ivain
If it's not passed down to the customer it should at the very least be passed to every shop-floor employee.
Dumbeachjuice
I’m laughing how someone thinks self checkout is innovation
KilroyLichking
if you told your grandfather that he would have to scan and bag his own groceries and pay im sure he would have killed someone
freemab
As if that innovation wasn’t subsidized by govt funding!
gaggedandgooped
That’s why every 5th item is free when I self checkout
IMakeLotsOfReferencesAndRemakes
"Got my toilet paper, my oranges, some milk, frozen pizza, aaaaaaand a 9070XT."
gaggedandgooped
jashkay1350
Innovate deez nuts in yo mouf
RandywithanI
Right? It’s not innovation. It’s literally me taking the job that was once operated by an employee, but for free.
ostensiblystupid
That’s flipping the idea of innovation on its head. Innovation since the invention of the wheel has been to make daily life easier.
Thinking of it as a lever to maximize the ease of daily life solely for the people who made it isn’t just capitalism, it’s a feudalist system for invention and functional access hoarding.
We have companies racing to automate labor for their benefit, while hoarding and redefining access to paid labor itself.
The innovation takes rather than contributing
andrewcmoffitt0
I work in IT for a company that sells these machines. It does definitely save some wages by having self checkout but there are a few more considerations. There is a pretty high failure rate on a self checkout and many stores have to keep fairly expensive contracts with POS support companies in order to make sure the machines keep running. I actually have to work on cloning one that had a drive die later today. Not really trying to be devil's advocate but I do have industry info on this.
hogeyegrex
If it wasn’t ultimately cheaper, they wouldn’t do it.
barstr7
But it doesn't require breaks, sick days or health benefits like an actual employee. Less employees means less managers to watch over them. Less uniforms and name tags to buy. Less space required for employees to store personal items and take breaks. And it can't sue you for lost wages, job injuries, discrimination, etc. Ultimately, it costs them a lot less even factoring in IT costs.
andrewcmoffitt0
Yeah, it's ultimately cheaper. The things do create some higher paying jobs like mine but less of them
boxbackknitties
I saw flop news just relentlessly attempting to trash this guy yesterday. It would have been funny, the hysteria and fear mongering they were so obviously trying to sow, except that I know there are those that are just lapping it up. Not one word about the illiterate moron’s corruption, pedophilia, stupid illegal wars, etc.
BeaverOnFire
They are all church approved activities.
GavManDu
"For that kind of money, they could buy everyone in NYC Costco memberships."
Yeah, sure lets make the most food-insecure New Yorkers travel to 1 of 3 Costcos actually in city limits (only in Brooklyn, Queens, and Staten Island, by the way)
WienerBeener
This is price pinning made politic. You know your avg viewer shops at costco so you make the fact of membership price "match" policy cost to make your viewer equate the two regardless of relevance. Simple and effective marketing. (Read, evil cunty shit smearing)
zHurk777
Where they have to lug back more than than need to save a buck and have no place to store it because NYC housing.
theshinobi23
Are goods cheaper at Costco or Sam's Club or other bulk buy stores? Sure, per item, but you have to buy in bulk. That means you have to have the money to get more at a time. And the entire point is that so many people don't have enough money to buy a week of groceries, so how can they suddenly afford a month's worth just because you gave them a free membership?
Daliena06
theshinobi23
Yup. The boots theory can apply here, as it's still "spend more now to save money in the long run." Even if some people would argue that that's specifically about quality, I say it amounts to the same general concept.
1stDrunkJoe
Thanks, I've been trying to explain this concept to people and this will help.
Daliena06
But you don't understand! The only reason the government should ever have money is to use it to subsidize private business! /s
JD67
Buying in bulk also ties up cash flow and storage space
mikeatike
The republicans that oppose this haven't ever seen the inside of a NY apartment.
Well except for one of the park place towers.
ZackWester
yep and also if your not a 4+ family most of the bulk goods are sort of hard to consume up before they go bad. and if you do manage its probebly becuase you been eating nothing but X for a month for 2 out of 3 meals out of that.
YouRadicalizedMe
You. They go to waste
GavManDu
Totally - I didn't even have room for furniture other than a bean bag in my 400 sq ft Manhattan apartment.
MCFLYYY
If they're selling 30% below market, how do they prevent scalpers from buying all of it up on the 1st of the month and then re-selling it at market price?
BobRossHB
Broken ankles, I know a guy named Sal that does honest work that could help. Or just let the folks in the parking lot know who is literally taking food from their children's mouths. System should 'self correct' at that point. You can hose down the parking lot later.
Iambadatnames1938
You just use the money to buy more stock. It's food. It's got a limited shelf life, its over produced. It's not like tickets or xboxes.
vonHoopla
Also, it's literally pointless. You'd have to sell it at more than the store price. Which means you'd be selling it at more than wholesale price. Which means all you did is open a grocery store with an extra middle man eating into your profits XD
iamthemurray
Would you buy produce and meats off your neighbor? I don't know how you can scalp perishables. I'm not sure who you are expecting to do the actual scalping. ( Not that I disagree people will probably find a way)
scotcherton
They'll buy seafood out of the back of a truck from a cooler 5 hours inland from the Gulf of Mexico. They would absolutely buy produce and meat from a neighbor.
iamthemurray
Damn you have a point actually. I forgot I had seen that almost same exact scenario in real life lol. Granted that guy was an actual crab fisher
firefighter26
Black market groceries out of the back of a van?
tzahtman
It is the only real way to buy kielbasa
Bystandr
The first item/bag of potatoes/whatever is 30% off. The second costs 5000% more.
WarKittyKat
Set some stock out every day like a normal grocery store? You're not gonna be getting fresh stuff like that in once a month anyway. Most stores are going to be restocking every morning and then throughout the day, so it's not like the guy who's first in line on the first of the month is going to clean them out for more than maybe 24h max. Plus enforce the existing licensing laws for selling food.
Whiskers7
He addressed it during the speech. The idea is to use a card system, so they can track purchases.
Also, it's only for staples, so they expire quickly. No one should be buying up all the milk and bread, as they are not able to on-sell them before they spoil. Canned goods like fruit and baby formula might be an issue though.
Adthay
Reselling where? Like you load your truck with bread and bannanas where do you go to sell it? First off it's probably illegal for you to sell produce from your truck, but secondly who's going to buy it? Becuase if you're selling for market price I'd rather just go to a market then get it from some dude. And if any of it doesn't sell that's money from your pocket, it's perishable it's not like a funko pop where you can keep it in a closet
numbonvalium
Set limits. Punish offenders.
MCFLYYY
That's fine. They better have a plan, because people are greedy and will certainly try this.
numbonvalium
It will probably have some growing pains, no plan survives first contact with the enemy.
TilSovngarde
Idk what they have planned. But some US military commissaries overseas have rations, or a cap, on how much you can spend per month to specifically combat scalpers from buying on base and then selling it off base.
MCFLYYY
But are they able to do this because everyone is ID'd and they can track spending?
TilSovngarde
Yes. But I’m sure if it became a problem they could easily assign customer numbers or something. A state/fed ID wouldn’t be necessary.
nickswoop
It would be pretty obvious if someone was trying to buy up so much stuff not for themselves. And where would the scalper sell? Would you buy milk at grocery store price from a guy on the sidewalk?
GarrisonFjord
Bodegas around here do this all the time, they buy milk or whatever from the grocery store a few minutes drive down the street and then resell it at their bodega at a higher price. If they can get it even cheaper than the grocery store and then sell it for a profit while still being cheaper than the grocery store, you bet your ass they'll buy up as much as they can.
FancyPayne
I know my bodega does this but sometimes I need milk, cheese, butter, bread, etc for tonight's meal and don't have time to run to the grocery store. I'm paying for the convenience. Plus the bodega owner is a small business owner, pays his employees a fair living wage and all of them are a valued part of our community/neighborhood.
GarrisonFjord
Heck yeah, and the good ones will sell you drugs.
Rakoth
In my experience, it's a local, family owned place. I've worked both bullseye and wally world, and you'd know it's a reseller because they'd want an entire skid's worth of milk, chocolate milk, or soda (especially if there's a really good sale) and they'd use a really stupid excuse like 'I need 80 cases of mountain dew and pepsi 'cos we're having a party'
LoudBirb
Okay? So just tell the managers/cashiers of this city-run store to not sell bulk. Set low item limits per person and ban people who abuse the system.
Better yet, make it explicitly fraud and hit them with massive fines and/or jail time for doing it.
Someone's always gonna try it anyway, but if you make it inconvenient to do and make an example out of anyone you catch doing it, very few people will. So long as enough's left for everyone who needs it, that's good enough.
MCFLYYY
If there wasn't any left in the store, and it was 10% less than a regular grocery store? And yes it would be obvious if someone was buying in bulk to re-sell. But that's also been obvious before, like with GPUs or with toilet paper during Covid or bottled water during a hurricane/flood etc. Nobody stopped those people. I'm just saying, people will try this, there better be a plan in place to prevent it.
CMLVI
I'd say that issue is probably something they'd prefer to tackle in this scenario, as the point isn't just to "sell" the product, it's to make it affordable and available to people. In those scalper scenarios, the purpose wasn't to make it affordable and available, but just to sell it. So why would the retail stores care if it's a scalper buying? It's bought with the same money, and then it's not their problem to deal with.
VladimirsKacs
Actually they would care - scalping means the price gouging opportunity wasn't fully realized.
It might be that prices are set centrally by corporate market researchers, and they think it's not worth it to adjust at every store, or something. But some overpaid office drone definitely made a powerpoint on the subject.
Alexap30
These are not private corporations that don't care who buys as long as the money flows. It's literally 5 city-run stores with a very specific purpose. They can say no to a person who buys a metric ton of meat, or all of the apples.
MCFLYYY
Can they though? I hope they can and will be able to.
Alexap30
"Can they though?"
That's doubt without any validity. Arguments people. Support your opinions, doubts, etc with valid arguments. You can't doubt something and then just Skeletor away.
Hovencl00f
Supermarkets constantly claim that they have a profit margin of only 2%, which is not at all what you will find when you check out the data you can find by checking out their websites or in their shareholders' reports.
StellarJay77
That may be somewhat true at final sale at the retail level, the thing is that most big grocery chains own the entire vertical from production, through logistics, then wholesale, and finally retail. They take their cut at each step of the process so the final end to end profit margin is way more than 2%.
LucilleWhoKnowsNot
On the internal Walmart scanners there's a button the employee can click to see the mark-up on the product. Type be amazed at some of the markups
WaxDragon
Costco is famously low, and their average is like....12%? 2% is a wild claim
rhalm
Item markup is not pure business profit, it also has to be used to cover operational costs. Costco makes a big portion of their money off the membership, not item markup, which is a big why their markup is low (along with bulk sales efficiency)
hetnkik999
I'm jealous because my mom's town has a WinCo (employee-owned company) and they're consistently way cheaper than the major grocery stores where I live, which are of course all publicly traded companies.
hogeyegrex
Utter codswallop. My local store has rotating sales where you use an app and scan the sale tags. They are routinely 30-50% off or more. The store isn’t losing money on this stuff. It just illustrates how badly they’re gouging on their regular prices.
MCNewYorkLives
I feel like a lot of places claim "razor thin margins" and it just doesn't make sense, otherwise it wouldn't be profitable to open.
I feel like a lot of the stats that create this claim are based on the fact that (a) many people start these businesses without any business sense/experience or (b) over saturation of the business resulting in smaller clientele.
Bystandr
Or: its a price gouging collusive rip off.
MCNewYorkLives
"both? Both"
But seriously, I don't doubt that the big name companies/businesses are doing that and just feigning "razor thin margins" (as the other guy said, likely mention profits AFTER they take a big cut). I'm just referring to all the small owners who decided to get into the restaurant business for easy cash without any clue what to do (regardless of validity, I'm thinking of the cases like in Kitchen Nightmare with Gordon Ramsey)
RobotDorsVenabili
Margin calculates after including labor cost, so really what it means is: 'executives calculated the profit, extracted 98% to pay themselves & shareholders, and left a 'razor thin' residual for the business to remain 'profitable' despite 'facing challenges'.'
Frobizzle
Plz provide said data.
Blunderwriter
LMFAO...I worked in grocery store for 15 yrs...typically (at that time anyway) it was 25%, and you did it by taking cost divide by .75, not cost X 1.25 so your profit of 25% was 25% of the retail price (it makes sense if you know - you know). 2% my fat ass...and yes, wages and all that have to come out of that but if they are passing off "2%" they're full of shit. And I made more than double/hr 35+ yrs ago than what the US min wage is today. (also WTF!?)
MCFLYYY
2% profit margin.....after they pay all the C Suite their exorbitant salaries and bonuses etc.
Hevach
Also their shoplifting crisis is manufactured by counting all sources or inventory adjustment, including defective returns, recalls, expired food, shipping discrepancies, store use, etc etc etc
djevelen
Yeah, i was going to say, there wouldnt be only like 3 actual large grocery chains if they only made 2% on profits.
BarryTheCyborg
Don't forget the stock buybacks and dividend payments to the investors!
kwogh
Yes and not just american stores do this bullshit, experiencing 30% more expensive prices and the stores claiming its because of inflation and then a year later reporting record profits is apparantly a swedish thing too.
retepronnoco
There’s a difference between what the corporations and what the actual store owners make. I’ve worked in the grocery industry and, at store level, margins (in Canada, anyway) are not amazing. However, the corporation that owns the banners (ie. National Grocers, also known as Loblaw Companies) make great money. NG sells its franchises to independent owners who operate stores. They also wholesale the goods to those stores. They also set the pricing those stores must follow. They control everything
lopix
And Loblaws owns most of their supply chains. They pay themselves all down to the line.
whoatherebigfella
Aren’t there also shelf placement fees that companies make to the stores?
retepronnoco
Sorry for double comment. To clarify, vendors pay that to the corporations, not the stores. Again, there’s a difference between store level and corporate level. Stores aren’t benefiting from that money, the corporation is.
retepronnoco
Absolutely. Vendors also pay to be featured in flyers.
upvoteFLUFFYthings
Recently watched a CBC Marketplace segment on grocery store chains and property controls. Another reason why food is so expensive.
https://youtu.be/RYdiFCPMpjc?si=78IpQjpcceLZiIVS
BananaForScaIe
Ontario Teacher's Pension Fund and McCain foods (maple leaf foods, etc) don't help at all, everyone is fine with massive profits for HUMAN ESSENTIALS all the way up to government.
IPoisonedDorcasMutton
Supermarkets definitely don't, but New York is famous for having a ton of small, local bodegas and family run grocers that do run on razor thin margins. It's up in the air how this will affect them.
GimcrackGewgaw
It's 1 store per borough. This won't impact bodegas citywide. And right now this grocery (and its prices) mostly exist as press releases. We'll see how many actually open, what prices are actually like, how much we subsidize it over time, whether the store is any good. City-owned stores in other cities have been kinda shitty. So yeah, up in the air in all kinds of ways. I'm rooting for it to be awesome but I am super skeptical this will improve food security for significant numbers of people.
RainierAlt
Specifically these are supposed to be opening in "food deserts" which already have a lower presence of food / grocery sellers, and the new stores won't have butchers, a deli, or sell lottery tickets to leave space for other stores. (Also, aside from the lottery tickets, I imagine those are an added expense to set up and maintain over just standard shelving and some freezer units.)
Badprenup
Yeah they are definitely added expense. At local grocery stores around here the deli counter is usually 15-30 feet long, depending on if they just do meat/cheese or if they also do potato/pasta salads, hot food items, etc. The deli cases are built more for display than storage, so they fit maybe 1/3 of what a normal waist-high shelf can hold. Plus you have the work area behind the counter (10-20 ft), dedicated deli staff, and expensive food prep equipment.
1/2
Badprenup
That's a lot of space being used, mostly just to give the illusion that you're getting fresh food. The hot food items? In a freezer in the back, then blasted in a convection oven or microwave (I forgot to account for the fridge/freezer in the back of the deli as additional space and cost in my first comment). Potato salad? Shipped on a truck in giant container, right next to the individual containers of the same stuff.
2/3
Badprenup
The meat and cheese is another story, generally a full ham or hunk of cheese ships better than pre-sliced. But that could still be handled on site, just with workers prepping it and putting out a bunch in the morning and refilling sold stock a couple times per day. 2 slicers, 1 scale, and a fridge that's 1/5 the size of the current fridge.
Yeah some people would bitch because they can't request their preferred thickness, but even that could be accommodated pretty easily while saving space/money