MeowMachine12
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Oct 27, 2023 6:22 AM
MeowMachine12
52914
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32
sadurdaynight
Their strategy is to float something outlandish, like "abortion should be illegal". And then see if people will retort with something else outlandish. Like "ok, then, but then guys should have to tie a rubberband around their dicks." And, that's when they consider it a "debate". So, from then on, they're negotiating the details with you. And if you tell them you were being sarcastic and to fuck off, they go "you're the asshole for not debating me!"
icmojo
(with the help and support of their doctor and hopefully the help and support of their partner)
mondeca
It's medical care, and therefore none of my business.
nikkococo1998
This guy votes
OGshogun
Let’s flip the script here. I don’t think you have the right to free choice of religion. In fact I’ll choose for you regardless of how you feel.
pleaseuseotherdoor
I mean, that is what the evangelicals want.
mothercrayon
ArcanisTheOmnipotent
There is only one reason to get an abortion that matters, and the reason is you are pregnant. Don't do it if you're not.
KingXizor
If a couple was dealing with an unwanted pregancy together and deciding together, it is still 51% minimum the pregnant one's choice in the matter and a flat majority should win on that decision.
AsheLake
That's fucking terrible logic, but at least you got to the right conclusion. If it's a poly relationship with 3 people, should the other 2 be able to out vote her? Absolutely not. Not all issues are democratic, least of all matters of personal, physical autonomy. Nobody else gets to vote on what I choose to eat, for example. Everyone at Thanks Giving might want me to eat the asparagus, but it's 100% up to me. I don't care if they vote about it. Personal health care is not democratic.
timefliesfruitflies
Vote!
itsjustplaid
But how can I feel like a hero and be admired by misogynists if I can't fight the easiest battle on the planet, a battle that has nothing to do with me?!
HollerinAtTheVoid
All for this, but now I'm waiting to see something like: "It doesn't matter why a pay reduction is necessary. This isn't reality tv where the audience gets an opinion. It's up to the business owner. Period. The end."
pleaseuseotherdoor
Add that to the things people will compare a woman's body to instead of thinking of her as an autonomous human... up there with "used car", "vessel for my seed", and "flower to be picked".
AsheLake
Businesses should never have been granted any kind of legal personhood in the first place. You might as well say, "...but now I'm waiting for someone to say something completely insane." Private property is not analogous to human rights.
thetinymonarch
A woman's choice only affects her, a companies choice affects others
MaxMschief
👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
Illithidbane
Federal law? Nah, let's make it States rights. Wait, we can do better. How about City rights, with each town deciding what works for them. Wait, go deeper, Streets rights. But what if my neighbor disagrees with me. Ok, Individual rights!
AnythingMuchShorter
How about total capitalism, no socialism. If someone owns a business they can do what they want. So we make it all about OWNERSHIP. No one can make you house refugees or homeless on your land. So lets show the libs, make it up to the person who owns the uterus! Haha, that'll show those commies.
MaxMschief
👏👏👏👏👏 Bodily Autonomy is a basic human right and it should be protected by ALL laws
simianruler
There isn't a period. That's usually one of the first signs.
falcon224
Are you proud of yourself? Of your joke? Because I am, well done
thewalkinged
The period follows the abortion, the end.
trikucian
Whatdoyousaytoanicecupoftea
Glad you said that
MySushi
I also came here to make this comedian comment, lol. But otherwise, I fully support this person's position on the issue
ChelVanin
They just love inserting their, er… opinions… without consent.
onetimepost9
Are you saying they raped her decision?
Schreibicus
Are you saying people need someone's consent to "insert" their opinions?
ChelVanin
In many situations, yes. If I’m having a private conversation with my doctor, you have no right to barge in and start delivering a third party opinion.
Schreibicus
The discussion is obviously about public forum. Just look at the picture being commented upon - I see no doctors there. The core issue is laughingly simple - at what age does fetus become a human? Once society decides on this point (which many have done already, but US is special, as usual) - feel free to kill fetuses, don't kill humans. Instead, each side bashes the other, liberal principles get casually ignored,
Schreibicus
... the swings go too far, scum like trump gets elected, funding for Ukrainian war effort gets cut - and now your innocent comment helps putin, congratulations!
onetimepost9
What?
gestug
I agree that personhood is at the core of the debate, but this misses a larger problem. We should not legislate minority opinion. We don’t debate murder because majority think it’s wrong, so it can be a crime.
ChelVanin
Since when does an abortion take place in a public forum?! And yes there is a doctor involved here, assuming we’re talking about a safe legal abortion. That’s implied.
Schreibicus
I never said abortion takes place in a public forum.
ChelVanin
And you’re wrong about the core issue. It’s not the personhood of the fetus. It’s bodily autonomy. The personhood debate is a red herring.
Schreibicus
No it's not. When it's a fetus, it's bodily autonomy. When it's a person, it's not bodily autonomy.
HoldingAccount
Up to birth? And the father has no say? That's one take on this issue, too. In Finland it is solely up to the mother until 12 weeks. After that only for certain (quite numerous) reasons, and the father must be heard.
Zaranthan
When I'm the one risking fatal complications, I can have a say, otherwise if she wants it gone, it's gone.
MaxMschief
Bodily Autonomy - the pregnant person's body; THEIR say.
HoldingAccount
Night before birth - abortion is okay. After birth - killing the baby is not. Is this what you’re saying?
ZombieCroc
While other people have explained this to you in other comments, "night before" type abortions are insanely rare and happen due to medical complications rather than "woopsie, I just spent 9 months suffering the physical transformation of creating a human but now I've changed my mind and don't want it." People who have abortions that late have likely picked a name, purchased clothes/toys, painted the baby's room, and are actively excited to have a child.
HoldingAccount
And still I’m saying that it’s not bodily autonomy if the mother can’t abort an 8 month old fetus. I’m not saying mothers should be able to do this (even though I’m of that opinion) but to state that bodily autonomy is not an absolute right as people are saying.
AsheLake
It is, though. You're just using a nonsense hypothetical to provoke an emotional response over an issue that affects real people. We call this 'arguing in bad faith.' If your hypothetical ever actually happened, there's a chance it would be worth discussing. Since it never does, it isn't. If you're going to insist on the relevance of an irrelevant scenario, we must assume you're here only to cause trouble.
paynoattentiontousernames
Not sure what reasons, but knowing Finland, it's probably reasonable.
HoldingAccount
They are.
AgainstMethod
Yeah, society still 100% has to come to a decision about when in a pregnancy there's a second individual person present and what rights they each then have. There's no dodging tye complexity there.
freshthrowaway1138
Not really. I have no responsibility to donate a kidney to save someone's life. No one has the right to force me to donate a kidney to save someone's life. I could literally be on the donor registry and in the hospital to donate; but change my mind and there is nothing anyone can do to force me to donate. There is no "second person" that has a right to my body. Ever.
AgainstMethod
The question isn't whether you can remove something from your body (you can). It's what obligation you, or the doctor, have to the individual once you've done so.
freshthrowaway1138
Nope, I've got zero responsibility to anyone else on that level. No one has that right to take away my bodily autonomy. And the idea of "the individual" is just another bit of propaganda to distract from the real issues.
AgainstMethod
We're talking about the point which society agrees that there is a living baby that has been removed from a person's body. At that point, the formerly pregnant person's bodily autonomy is not at risk and either they or a doctor has a moral and legal responsibility to render aid to the baby, which makes it no longer an abortion, which is why we have laws about the point past which abortion is illegal.
MaxMschief
No complexity 🌺 - Bodily Autonomy is simple: Pregnant person's body; THEIR choice.
AgainstMethod
The complexity is what one is obligated to do with the person being removed from a body once we can agree that it's a person.
AsheLake
If a doctor can save its life, they should do so. Otherwise, they can't. There's not much complexity here either. You are entitled to control your own body, as is everyone else entitled to their own. You are not entitled to someone else's body, ever.