splungedude
96941
1949
39
By Bird and moon: http://www.birdandmoon.com/comic/strategies
Dec 5, 2020 12:04 PM
splungedude
96941
1949
39
By Bird and moon: http://www.birdandmoon.com/comic/strategies
LokJok
Oil execs telling the public to "do their part" is them shifting responsibility to an individual, where the solution must be system-wide.
Illtrytoexplain
lol 1950s first international report. Boomers now : "Why ecologists are so radical ?!"
ssumner13
If you believe in us being saved by green energy think again, I was deeply saddened after watching this https://youtu.be/NXY2mnXT7GQ
OptimisticSchrodinger
Shell oil. Shame people into thinking that it’s what they do that’s causing the problem, not decades of corporate denial and misinformation.
Thatannoyinggit
I picked a fight with Shell on LinkedIn, boy that got a lot of traction!
Bumbasaywhat
Also... Ya know... Agriculture.
T0go
https://www.npr.org/2020/12/02/941030964/adding-red-seaweed-to-cow-feed-could-cut-bovine-flatulance there are solutions if we have the will
SpasticTactician
There needs to be more mustache twirling to really get the right feel.
IamJacksanxiety
Didn't South Park have a "sorry episode"
wibbIywobbIytimeywimey
Noroelle
Im willing to change capitalism to a more regulated state. I’m willing to change big greedy Corps. I’m willing to change politicians .../1
Noroelle
/2 the Rest I have already - LED lamps everywhere. Geothermal heating, solar, etc. It’s not on the endusers alone to save this planet
TanithRosenbaum
Straight out of the capitalist's playbook: Privatize profits, socialize losses and blame.
amycollins3
"Mustache twirling not enough, let's add some oil-soaked hubris to the mix."
SkwiggumsMcDingo
Crime's against humanity trial when?
T0go
This will go down as the biggest crime in history. Calling it now. Probably will be another 50 years before most agree.
cnphilli
What's the crime? Selling a product we all clamor for and convincing politicians to give them money?
T0go
A multimillion dollar PR campaign to lie to the public about the consequences of their rapacious looting and bribing politicians, yes.
T0go
Plus, you know, the literal crimes https://cfpub.epa.gov/compliance/criminal_prosecution/index.cfm?action=3&prosecution_summary_id=2468
IxnayOnTheOttenRay
I drive a small sedan that gets 40mpg.
brandonblk
its almost like consumers only make 10% of the pollution or something
Bystandr
And they try to find ways to make it illegal to put up solar farms and no one wants to talk about building a thorium reactor
Bystandr
https://hbr.org/2016/12/solar-is-being-held-back-by-regulations-not-technology
Bystandr
http://www.janleenkloosterman.nl/reports/thesis_pool_2013.pdf
MiniMegaOfParagonCity
When I was in school in the 90s,we had textbooks saying the earth was cooling and heading for a new ice age.
MiniMegaOfParagonCity
I had a science magazine with an article by David Suzuki insisting on the coming ice age.
MiniMegaOfParagonCity
My dad told me how they used to say we would run out of oil soon and be plunged into the dark ages, and before that it was coal.
MiniMegaOfParagonCity
Stuff like this is why I used to doubt climate change. There was always claims of some looking disaster and they were always bullshit.
MiniMegaOfParagonCity
It's hard to believe the real threat when you spend your life listening to doomsayers preaching gibberish.
Cranbananarama
Would it help if their HQ caught fire and people repeated their words to them?
ScreamedVoid
You realize that we just keep using fuel right? This is capitalism. They sell it because we want it... Also fuck Shell, but fuck us all, too
Scrappy1841
Its mainly just cheap energy. The world runs on cheap energy even democratic socialist countries export oil, Venezuela exports oil, China
Scrappy1841
Imports oil and coal on a massive scale and is one of the leading producers of carbon emissions. The world needs cheap energy to work now.
Isi151e
Tired of waiting, I'm gonna have my own climate change. With blackjack and hookers
RVME
It is all about rhetoric: you don't have to prove you're right. All you have to do is instill enough doubt so that nothing tangible's done
alex5775
An important to note for 91 is that climate change probably is a theory but so is gravity. Theory is more concrete in science than in lamens
Quietkitsune
Yep. A scientific theory is 'this how we think what we observe works' while the scientifically illiterate think 'may or may not even exist'
ohmygodtheysaidnewzealand
David Attenborough says, have less kids, eat less meat, use renewable energy instead of fossil fuels.
01010101011100110110010101110010011011100110000101101101e
Lol I like how all these oil company big wigs are telling us about how we need to be doing our part
blurgh
sure! *sharpens guillotine*
DoDucHuy
I pledge to not spill oil into the Gulf and make regime changes in the middle East for profits!
MasterE
It's a sad but true fact. We vote with our money, those who can afford it need to spend their money and expend effort supporting 1/?
MasterE
Renewable energy. As long as there is a profitable market for fossil fuels big oil companies will exist. 2/2
ImperialSecurityBureauAgentShab
The problem is most people are dependent on fossil fuels because it is prohibitively expensive to switch to renewables. Gov action is what
ImperialSecurityBureauAgentShab
Will effect change. Which means vote for people who arent big business shills, promote efficient nuclear reactor s
aramus
Stop using their products.
cnphilli
That's what the last tile is saying. But apparently since an oil exec said it, it's evil.
busterfixxitt
What am I willing to change? I'm willing to fucking nationalize every goddam energy company to force change. How 'bout that? ?
TheyDontKnowAndYouCantTellEm
I know Rex's mom. Gonna have to show her this one.
thesauceisboss
fraxinusoleaceae
Using angry & disappointed moms and grandmas has worked against gangs; maybe we can use it on energy, finance & pharma CEOs too.
thulindar22
It's been shown that running a big company rewards ruthlessness and lack of empathy, I'd be surprised to find any one of them wasn't a 1/
thulindar22
Textbook sociopath. Therefore I find it unlikely that anyone's disapproval would phase them at all, good thought though.
fraxinusoleaceae
Yeah fair. Sometimes though the target of shame isn't an individual's behaviour change, but rather to raise the costs of loyalty for 1/
fraxinusoleaceae
those that enable them. Lackeys, lawyers, gov't allies, investors, purchasers of ad space, museums naming buildings, etc.
Takethejump
Great, then backhand her across the mouth for raising a monster.
romagnolimike27
You know, in the 1970s, there was a long-lasting popular theory amongst scientists that we were in a phase of global cooling that may.....
romagnolimike27
lead to an ice age. Boomers remember this, and I certainly do as a Gen-Xer. It is my belief that it was this theory and the change....
romagnolimike27
in theories on climate later that lead many to believe that scientists do not what they are talking about regarding climate change and more.
yesiamclutz
Or you know, billions spent in targeted disinformation by the fossil fuel companies...
romagnolimike27
I'm not saying that didn't play into it, but the theory was widespread and often talked about. I have seen it cited many times by deniers.
Krembananen
The fact that the most groundbreaking science on climate change was paid for by oil companies is insane. They strategized for it.
dnd3edm1
the old white men running the companies would be dead before it was a problem. NBD I guess
MaintenanceNeeded
They want to be able to control it when it 'switches'. Get what they can now, be the savior and get more money later... play the long con
StormWingDelta
Pretty sure the oil companies wanted a different answer than what they got too. XD
T0go
Exxon had an internal power struggle between engineers and scientists and oilmen in the late 70s/early 80s. The oilmen won.
jetflight
Psst! Energy production. That's the key. Nuclear mostly. Solar, if you can do it cheap enough and preferably in orbit.
HeWhoMustNotBeBlamed
Nuclear is 4-10x more expensive than solar, hydro and wind. Only vested interests and their blind followers want nuclear. Fuck them.
jetflight
Solar and wind are the least efficient power sources for now. While solar is the future, that's mostly because of the Sun's energy output.
GWZipper
Different sources for different locations. Geothermal in Iceland, solar in Nevada, wind in Iowa, with nuclear filling in the gaps
cnphilli
And this will all happen once the price of oil gets high enough.
GoddamnitClown
Cool as it would be, I doubt orbital solar is going anywhere. Launch is *not* cheap and you would, essentially, be building a death ray.
jetflight
Launches get cheaper by the day. Also, the Moon is a gigantic ball of raw materials from which it's fairly trivial to launch.
GoddamnitClown
Sure, now more than ever. But providing for any part of our energy would involve launching many orders of magnitude more than all of /1
GoddamnitClown
history combined. "Cheap" is just not going to cut it. And any such project would still be a death ray almost by definition.
GoddamnitClown
Shipping some fuel, like hydrogen, down in manageable parcels is conceivable, but still not a near term solution to anything.
StormWingDelta
Power Satellites + a few other things = we might be able to win this game. :P
VodkaReindeer
As much as I like nuclear, we missed our chance decades ago. Now it's too late to too anything significant with it.
mindstorm8191
Why is it too late, though? Sure, there are risks, but we can minimize them
VodkaReindeer
It'd take too long to build a significant amount of it.
FailedCrate
Du laberst zu großen Teilen einfach nur Scheisse.
AmHumanNotLizardMan
You babble too much partly easily just shit? Ich lerne Deutsch aber verstehe das nicht.
FailedCrate
"You babble in most parts plainly just shit." - means in a small part s/he is right.
twozerooz
Solar is too expensive. Wind is already as cheap as nuclear, thus why it's the fastest growing source of energy worldwide.
zagibu
You can't put up windwheels where there is no wind. Well you can, but it doesn't help.
twozerooz
There's wind pretty much everywhere. What are you talking about?
zagibu
Yeah? Is this the reason why they are putting windwheels miles off the shore in the ocean?
twozerooz
Easier legislatively, not because there's no wind. Do you ever get outside?
3Davideo
The problem with orbital solar power is that the $/panel have dropped far faster than $/lb to orbit. It's so much cheaper per watt to >
3Davideo
> build, say, 10 km^2 of panels on the ground than 1 km^2 in space.
zagibu
You don't even need panels. Black pipes in front of a reflective trough in the desert and you have a great steam generator.
jetflight
Don't need to start with giant panels in space, can do relatively smaller ones and concentrate light with cheap, thin aluminum mirrors, 1/2
jetflight
which can easily be mined from the Lunar regolith. This is why I'm hoping to see Artemis take off well. 2/2
mindstorm8191
True, but eventually space will become a concern. Space lets us expand how much solar power we can collect. But... we're not there yet
3Davideo
Nowhere near. I mean, think about exactly how much rooftop area there is that isn't covered with solar panels.
mindstorm8191
True. This would reduce heating costs on houses too, without the sun blazing its heat on the roof
stonewalljackson27342
Oil companies are mainly about that petroleum which mostly goes to transportation. Very difficult to beat that kind of energy density.
jetflight
Yeah, but energy abundance makes cleaning up after cars much easier - and those are constantly getting cleaner as is.
Camelspotting
I'm hoping we can crack high density hydrogen storage.
CoRfr
It is very hard to beat the convenience and energy density of oil, which is going to make the aftermath that much more difficult.
cnphilli
It will get beaten when oil gets to expensive.
stonewalljackson27342
So you need to do two things, electrify transportation, and make electric production clean. Must have both, just one doesn’t work.
StormWingDelta
Don't necessarily have to beat that energy density do we? Just need to make things that can run off less at the same or similar levels?
CoRfr
Nuclear can help with the hangover, a little bit like an Advil after a binge drinking party, but it's still a finite world.
cnphilli
From humans perspective, solar energy might as well be infinite.
Ermahgerdness
The problem with global warming isn’t finite resources. It would actually be better if fossil fuels were more finite.
karlingkoss
Looj up thorium reactors, that's the future that oil
twozerooz
Thorium is just like fission. It's always "just a decade away". Thorium has a lot of unsolved engineering challenges.
karlingkoss
Doesn't want
Novemburr
for sure. molten salt thorium reactors would be the tits.
Jazzcabage
Awesome, let's produce energy tities!! I'm all for it!
Jazzcabage
If it can actually be done efficiently like proponents claim. Seems like alot of stuff I've read/watched seems like it's not that easy and>
Jazzcabage
Some of the info almost comes across as a conspiracy theory rather than actual scientific evidence
jetflight
Thorium and uranium both, yeah. Uranium offers more bang for the buck, but thorium is also loads more common, so...
karlingkoss
Bro russian has thorium reactors now
erikna
Why not both ;). However, uranium extraction is a major enviromental hazard whereas thorium is not
FarkasMacTavish
He literally led with "both".
jayman0123
As if leveling blacksmithing wasn't already a pain now you guys are taking all the thorium
jetflight
Well how else are you going to get into raiding? Molten Core awaits!
ikilledvestein
How do you get orbital solar energy to the surface?
ChibiYui
You build three orbital elevators and string an artificial 'ring' of solar panels between them.
debthepleb
Really large magnifying glass to concentrate the sun rays and turn them into electricity efficiently
chine
A death ray. I'm not joking
SirBagels
I mean you're exaggerating a bit. It's only deadly if you jump through it.
erikna
Lasers or microwave. The technology is not quite there yet but it is doable on paper
MagikarpsSplashWasSuperEffective
One possibility is geosynchronous orbiting mirror/lenses, focusing sunlight onto a surface water reservoir to generate steam power
Jazzcabage
I wonder how difficult it would be to make that an effective form of energy production
Flowerlady0
Cool, a new death ray
Rebonack
Imagine all the birds that would cook.
korndogg83
Clean energy sponsored by KFC.
jetflight
You beam it down to a ground receptor. From there on, it works just like a regular solar panel would.
cnphilli
I was really thrown off when the comment said "energy production, preferably in orbit" this is orbital reflectors.
PunIshErnest
Sounds hella inefficient
NaughtButOne
Depends on tech used. Microwave transmission from orbit is ~80% efficiency, minus atmospheric attenuation, on top of solar cell efficiency.
Jazzcabage
Yes, very.
ikilledvestein
Is there a risk of that being used as, y'know, death ray?
Jazzcabage
Its either that or produce plutonium for nuclear weapons. Pick your poison
ikilledvestein
I think there are reactor designs which do not produce plutonium.
GoddamnitClown
Yes. It could be ameliorated to a degree, but probably not enough to assuage the concerns of the countries it overflew, ie every country.
jetflight
There is no power source that cannot be weaponized.
c001namehere
In many markets solar is already cheaper than coal
debthepleb
Yep √
Mordin
My favorite story is a coal power plant, using solar power to power their own equipment as it's cheaper than the power they make with coal.
Lostchild12
IIRC it was a coal mine & a coal museum?
scanerang
But is solar actually renewable? After a solarpanel's lifecycle it can't be recycled properly
yacovia
https://earth911.com/eco-tech/the-state-of-solar-panel-recycling-in-the-u-s/
Kittynomnoms
Not yet. One of the best ways to develop technology is to put it to use. Also, the main focus right now should be reducing CO2 emissions.
Camelspotting
Nothing's actually renewable. Damn you entropy.
tonality
Renewable refers to the source, not the method of capture, so yes, it is.
yacovia
Seems doable but the US doesn't have the infrastructure at the moment from what i skimmed
heardthisusernamewasnttaken
Source? A quick search says they mostly glass plastic and aluminium
zagibu
Solar panels still maintain close to 90% of their original efficiency after 25 years.
Jazzcabage
That's issue we still need to work out with alternative power production.the toxic waste, expenses of safely handling it all and the>
Jazzcabage
Eventual depletion of rare earth elements ect.