iceage2012
161631
1685
16
26-inch thick armor from a Japanese Yamato class battleship, pierced by a US Navy 16-inch gun. The armor is on display at the US Navy Museum.
Oct 21, 2021 2:42 PM
iceage2012
161631
1685
16
26-inch thick armor from a Japanese Yamato class battleship, pierced by a US Navy 16-inch gun. The armor is on display at the US Navy Museum.
LovesToSpooge517
This makes me think about Francis Ngannou’s punching power. Like a Ford escort.
gentleherpes
Accurate flex but ok
undeadlemur
Armor was 25 inches thick ..close though.
throwawaytovvent
I am a machinist/welder on aircraft and this terrifies me.
MaximumWesker
so if they come up with 52-inch armor all we need is 32-inch guns. I figured it out with science.
ImperatorNikolai
The largest gun ever fired in anger was the 31.5” schwere Gustav
pixelsnader
But... 16 is less than 26?
ropetopus
I understand the physics, but it still seems unreal a gigantic ship made of 26-inch-thick steel can float
kingrd
Big guns are even scarier than small guns
tinyCabbage
that's shell has 184,831,155 ft/lb of energy. The .50bmg bullet that can penetrate light tank armor, has 11,000
Lightsmith
Not thick enough.
Tedster59
http://www.navweaps.com/index_tech/tech-040.php relevant techical document on the test.
demosteness
War is hell. Fuck war.
Meigeall
Do you think there were crazy conspiracy theorists back then claiming this kind of thing was all staged? I really don't know and am curious.
ekzeko
Well considering no Yamato class was ever sunk or captured after a battle against US ships, and this plate was actually from a leftover-
ekzeko
turret the US picked up post-war and shot at in testing conditions... It isn't the result of a battle like the post suggests but doesn't-
ekzeko
litterally state. Information is funny like that.
Splosions
Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest son of a bitch in Space!
Auxilium
So that's pre atomic steel, cost a fortune?
lurkbot3010
Warthropies beat capitalism
putcleverusernamehere
I guess they needed 27-inch thick armor
pikkunalle
Is this from Yamato or Mushashi?
somnif
Neither, it was from a third of the class that ended up converted into the carrier Shinano (this shot is from post-war testing of parts)
Tezunegari
Neither. A spare part used for post-war weapons testing from the third Yamato class ship (converted into Aircraft carrier Shinano)
RiverRoyal
Old style Battleships and their big guns are frightening: “I’m gonna hurl this 32inch rock sized shell 5 miles at you”
WinstonSmith101
Uh, have the Japanese demanded it back? No? British Museum stops sweating...
johannsendrilling0
Will it be ok ?
somnif
To give some scale of the shell responsible
HardAsARockMainline
"you should see the slug" -26-inch thick armor
GreyArea51
Big Bada Boom
WhoUhz
NotAHugeSpider
CallThisAUsername
No need to be so technical, you nerd. /s
SenorBojangles
Bada baig boom
BeastofKnowledge
Fuck the Japanese Navy in WW2 (unmuted)
AmHumanNotLizardMan
Meanwhile the US military *only* used incendiary and nuclear weapons on civilian targets.
BlueWater321
One served a military purpose
kingrd
And here I thought the Japanese weren't brutal at all in WW2!!! /s
SoulJha
26-inch = 66,04 cm in human measurement
ChicoSlim
= 3 bahn ahn yahs.
davyclam
Oh, so that's 66.04 Napoleons, a famous mass murderer.
notblubber
Should have sprung for the 27-inch.
YourIceCreamMan
Similar devastation
talianagisan
That looks like a Kurogane scout car.
YourIceCreamMan
Good eye. And hats off to FG writers for that detail.
talianagisan
I checked with my fellow re-enactor and actually they said its not, and they're right. Toyota AB Phaeton but shorter like a kurogane.
DontTazeMeBrah
Oh, my God
dogfavoriter
Good lord. 2240 pound (1020 kg) shell with a muzzle velocity of 2300 ft/s (700 m/s). That's like getting hit by a Buick going Mach 2.
NateNuss
Anyone that's awesome at science.. could you do the math on what's the force that it hits at being that size shell? Like in joules?
phobosorbust
E = 1/2 mv² so 1020 kg @ 700 m/s is 250 MJ, or about 430,000 .357 magnum rounds.
phobosorbust
That's about 60 kg of TNT just in kinetic energy, although that means the shell's payload matters for damage effects.
dohcohv
Buick weighs way more than that, 2200lbs is Miata sized.
dogfavoriter
With the impact concentrated into an area the size of one of its hubcaps.
coreydeangibson6
2700lbs this one is the super heavy round
q2grapple
Imagine the sound that hit made
Hashbrown123
"You sunk my battleship."
RiverRoyal
“plink” ???? ? er…. Perhaps not…
agathos
The Yamato and Musashi were both sunk by aircraft. Neither was ever engaged by US battleships.
doggb17658888
Yamato "class" warship not the actual Yamato. But you are correct. Just trying to help ?
TheAlviss
The Yamato waaass a remarkable torpedo pincushion when it went down.
mintakka
“Yamato Class”
ImperatorNikolai
This plate was originally from a turret for the third Yamato class BB, which was turned into the carrier Shinano
JackTheRippersBrotherHowie
shinano sunk by USS Archerfish, correct?
ImperatorNikolai
And if I remember correctly the Navy didn’t believe the commander’s claim
JackTheRippersBrotherHowie
Gallant Lady - book about the Archerfish, read it years ago, Operation Petticoat [tony curtis] also good movie sorta based on Archerfish
agathos
Okay, so this is from testing spare parts after the surrender? Makes sense.
ImperatorNikolai
Exactly
hipifreq
Correct, but this plate is from neither
aap71
hah! i love it. facts matter! lovely story. made up.
NKato
There was a third Yamato class that was aborted and converted into a carrier. The plate is from one of the spare turrets intended for it.
hipifreq
Yes, facts matter, and the fact is that this IS from a Yamato class battleship, just not the two @agathos mentioned
aap71
an important point, i think
agathos
I woke up on the nitpicky side of bed this morning, so I can't call the Shinano a Yamato class battleship. A Yamato class hull, sure.
hipifreq
True, I think you've got something there
Swampplatapus
How is this possible?
Jimmyb3121
Humans are very good at finding ways to destroy
Mewmus
big ba-da boom
TheWarHymn
Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest SOB in space! (and on Earth as well)
rumandbass
Caliber with decimal places moved to the right.
Thranx
per other linked documents... 2700lb projectile going 1992 feet/second. Wow.
vicvalour
dickblack12
F=MA
Biocide669
Fucked = My Ass that bit of armor at least.
kakivara
P=MV
thiscantbtaken
I used to remember that by saying “pomentum” in my head.
Boxingjedi
'Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest son-of-a-bitch in space' -Gunnery Chief in Mass Effect
Cronos51101
E=M*V^2 and P=F/A
HardAsARockMainline
Oh i didn't realize yours was kinetic energy, too. Yeah, and pressure
Merdock
E_k= (1/2)*M*V^2
Cronos51101
Fuuuuuuuuuu.... I forgot the 1/2..... Good catch....
BoriqaenKansas9000
FEMA?
tr0lleyjack
HardAsARockMainline
Kinetic Energy=m*v²/2
uzerok
It's a bit more complicated than that. Hardness and shape of the projectile and hardness, ductility of the target matter a lot.
turketron3000
Don't forget about hardness
CyborgScribe
If you get the speed fast enough all matter is basically just different viscosity liquids when it interacts.
uzerok
1 At the velocities we're talking about here, tungsten penetrators remain rather solid compared to something like lead. For reference I'm
uzerok
2 currently reading Terminal Ballistics from Zvi Rosenberg and Erez Dekel. It's a bit more complex than a Mass Effect quote.
ImperatorNikolai
Captured plate from an unfinished battleship, shot during postwar testing
Canigetbannedagain
Ya know... Physics.
XXXassclown
B.F.G!
Jawesome19
minimum velocity with this projectile at normal) estimated at 1839 feet/second -----that's how. It also didn't pass through but was lodged
Jawesome19
That's about 1200 mph the bullet is traveling
racerx0
things that go BOOM
Tom40
Obviously 16 inch > 26 inch, when you add momentum.
picselator
Aliens
Jawesome19
The barrel is 60 foot long.
or0b0ur0s
The equivalent of a solid steel compact car, packed to the headliner with high explosive, moving at several times the speed of sound.
Tedster59
http://www.navweaps.com/index_tech/tech-040.php relevant test info.
SpoilsburyToastMan
Really big guns... Firing REALLY big bullets:
Swampplatapus
This is starting to make sense.
andreyhimself
Boom boom boom iashkjsasay eyoooo eyoooo
GborCseh
One thing to clarify. The armour is 26 inches thick. The gun is 16 inches in diameter.
somnif
Swampplatapus
That...adds perspective.
somnif
They also used like 600+ lbs of propellant to get them moving, so, quite a bit of OOMPH behind those things.
Swampplatapus
Wow, is that per bullet/shell?
somnif
Yep, per shot. Each bag in this pic is 50kg, for example (different shell, but only pic I have on hand)
NarratorDurden
F=ma
copingcabana
Through physics, all things are possible.
MyFavoritesArePrettyNeatIGuess
16in is the diameter of the round.
DirtPoorFarmerSeedingUsersub
Magnets?! I dunno. No one knows how magnets work
Isorikk
Well, most physicists and electrical engineers know how they work
malachilenomade
NooneIRL
nat300Lord
Science?
DickMercenary
Because Sir Isaac Newton is the deadliest son of a bitch in space!
APimpNamedGod
wE Do NoT eYe bAlL iT
DickMercenary
YOU ARE NOT A COWBOY SHOOTING FROM THE HIP!
Exyr
Speed beats armor.
Spreckles450
Mass tends to help some
Exyr
To an extent. Look up calibers like the 5.7 or the 7.5fk burno small bullets super fast. Pistol rounds that defeat body armor.
bearstowsbarnstormers
Yeah but the v has the 2 above it in the kinetic energy equation.
Thewayofthebear
Exactly. Velocity is king.
schmau
Actually: it’s a vector quantity that measures displacement (or change in position) over the change in time. :)
thiscantbtaken
Fellow physics person!
schmau
Thewayofthebear
Well you sound like you know. I was going on what I was told in the RN. Smaller calibre but higher velocity, gets job done
Isorikk
A very fast pebble? No. Force! The product of mass and acceleration
TacoPoweredHelicopter
Accelerate a pebble to almost the speed of light and yiu get a ton of force. So yes a fast pebble.
Isorikk
If you found a cannon from WWII that can shoot pebbles at the speed of light you'll probably win a lot of awards
keillrandor
Well, when two bits of metal love each other very much...
LongoloidFartExplosion
I'd say hate in this context.
FallingStar7669
Physics. When two objects of identical density collide, they will penetrate each other an equal distance, depending on the energy of +
FallingStar7669
+ impact. So if you get 26 inches of steel moving fast enough, it'll penetrate 26 inches of steel. And get destroyed in the process. From +
FallingStar7669
+ there you change the variables; density, shape, &c.
ijustmadeanaccounttoargue
Big bada boom. Giant bullet go very fast.
blaghart
The faster something travels the harder it hits when you try and stop it. Even a string can penetrate this armor if it goes fast enough.
Teawrecks66
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/16-inch/45-caliber_Mark_6_gun massive rounds.
pritolus
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/46_cm/45_Type_94_naval_gun but not quite as massive as the ones fired by the Yamato class ships
Sigh101
1K+ KG rounds, APCBC at that. What the hell! Imagine the energy on that round hitting something, a hot fucking shitstorm
123idrinkpeee
That shell weighs about the same as my car
StrangePoster
Now imagine if your car were suddenly propelled at 1,568 mph (or 2,523 kmh)
JupiterMiningCorpRep
And relatively bad quality armour.
Lilly64
"...originally intended to fire the relatively light 2,240-pound (1,020 kg)...shell" and then they went with a bigger one
TheMayo16
Why you ask? Because America
AmHumanNotLizardMan
Weird for me to think about that one of those 6 barrels is more than 3x the diameter of the 4.5" MK8 gun I worked on, that was big enough...
ImperatorNikolai
I think the gun used in this penetration test was the 16”/50 caliber Mark 7
dkevelx
You’re correct.
guitardemon66
Ok that 45 puts my 1911 to shame ?. There’s .45 ….. and then there’s 45 ?
dkevelx
Iowa class guns were 50 cal. The mk vi 45’s were used in the older SoDak and North Carolina class ships.
Mikeythefireman
That decimal magically disappears and so does the target.
BearEvasion
Gone, like a fart in the wind.
Account3577
On a gun like this calibre refers to length, its 16" Diameter and the barrel is 16x45 inches long. No I don't know why its done like that
ProphetofEntropy
cause longer barrels extract can more power from the powder charge so its an important number
ElbowDeepInAPoliceState
When the speedy metals go ZOOM it penetrates the stationary T H I C C metals.
kennerly
The shells weigh 2,240 lbs. that’s how.
Swampplatapus
Dang!
dkevelx
2700. These were the super heavy shells for the Iowa’s.
pallyman
And 1.2m of recoil.
TheWarHymn
And flying out the gun at twice the speed of sound.
Swampplatapus
That is fast for something that heavy!
jjw9
Si vis pacem, para bellum …
Swampplatapus
Like holding a pair of binoculars
beartato
The lords caliber 45 ACP baby! (jkjk)
MisterRichard
Huge fucking gun, Japanese metal not so great at the time
funkwumasta
They didn't fold it over 1000 times.
MisterRichard
Fun fact: folding it ten times gives 1024 layers. Folding 1000 times gives you a blade as wide as the solar system
makeSX
Thats what the evaluation board also thought, until they did test shooting and it was actually good. Read the wiki article on the subject
TheAlviss
Because the fleet was a turn-key purchase from Vickers and manufactured in Britain.
MisterRichard
The Yamato was built at Kore. They were using British steel tech, but domestic materials and labor.
TheAlviss
Yeah, I mentioned in the other replies that I wasn't clear at all. I was referring to the metallurgy.
makeSX
The old fleet yes. Then they decided to make their own ships.
puffyjacket69
Because ships from every country at that time would fair better against that round? Get bent.
MisterRichard
That's not what I said, and right back atcha.
TheAlviss
Most of the Japanese fleet was purchased from vickers and made in Britain. The steel isn't a problem, its the AP shell that hit it.
ShadeEmberi
the yamato was not built in Britain
TheAlviss
I didn't say it was. I said a large portion of their fleet was purchased. Obviously prior to ww2 the first battleship they bought was Kongo
TheAlviss
I should edit my response to be more clear
TheWarHymn
I thought the Japanese had their own domestic ship armour production (based on British specs) by the start of the conflict? This particular/
TheWarHymn
specimen was made in Japan, or else the Americans won't had bothered to test it.
TheAlviss
I really should have been more clear. The first of Japan's modern warships were made in Britain. The Yamato was designed using British techn
TheAlviss
They did! I wasnt clear at all with my last statement. Lack of characters per comment, stream of consciousness, and all that.
[deleted]
[deleted]
ElbowDeepInAPoliceState
1/His swords were still made with low grade metals compared to Europe, India, or mainland Asia. Their method of smelting produced lots of
ElbowDeepInAPoliceState
2/ impurities in the metal, hence all the folding that had to be done to remove the slag and even out the impurities. The same processes for
ElbowDeepInAPoliceState
3/steelmaking and working were performed everywhere else (Europe, Africa, India, Mainland Asia, etc.), japanese sword making was neither
zagibu
Uh, no? He would exactly know how shitty it was. Why do you think it took so much work to make a decent sword?
ArchonIlladrya
There's a reason katanas had so many layers. They had to fold the shit out of the steel to make it resemble anything useful.
1019181716151413121
Him and other legendary japanese sword makers are praised for making good weapons out of shit steel.
BrdCdn
The funny part is they may be good for shit steel, but in testing they are still way worse than a European steel sword.
1019181716151413121
Well yeah. That's my point. Is that these particular artisans had to make do with sub-par materials.
DarkRedCape
Hattori Hanzo would have been dead for almost 550 years at this point. So the metal he worked with was likely rather different to the 1940s.
barnsandnobel
Jesus i wasnt being serious. I was also thinking of the one from kill bill.
SarcasticComment
Japan's sword making techniques were born out of how shit their domestic metals were
ElbowDeepInAPoliceState
1/Japan's sword smithing techniques were unremarkable and used everywhere else when working with that sort of metal. Their ores weren't even