ilovefwc
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Jul 27, 2020 12:37 AM
ilovefwc
95414
2669
85
deasmuth
Good for you!
shado3me
60 days today
IsupposeIam
SimmaSinger
Hey we’re twins, I’m 10 years this week too! Congratulations brother.
sometimesidontevenknowwhyibother
Good job @OP!
Zombingaround
NotDrunkEnoughForThis
My uncle just hit his 25 years sober. Keep it up, lad.
Naresch
Respect this is really something to be proud of!
PingNuDancer
1.5 years! Best decision ever.
banananutcheerios
My dad quit when I was 9. AA saved him, mine, my families, lives. When he passed, 9 of his old AA buddies came and gave us his 35 year pin.
Timheretoo
I’m seriously choked up. I know what this means. So thankful for men and women with your courage. Keep going!
ConstantinCosuleanu
:) good job. for me it is the exact opposite: i always have to remind myself to drink something to relax. I'm more of a workaholic. GJ to u!
RVME
You've inspired me to order my 40 year chip. It's beautiful! Congratulations!
justonemorepicturepls
Oh look, it's the "No true scotsman" fallacy. Never delude yourself into thinking what you're doing can't be improved
Corynthos
Sober for a month now. Feeling just as crappy as before.
tsunamisue
Congrats on ten years! It's a blooming miracle!!
appleofnewtonseye
Congratulations! You’re an old timer now!
AngeloSchilling
"But what about the hundreds or possibly thousands who 'fail' every year?" "They just didn't follow it thoroughly enough." <- bullshit logic
aloysiuscentauri
Correct. This might not be a bad thing. It means that person has not experienced enough pain to adhere to our path.
aloysiuscentauri
Please remember, our path is not for everyone. Many get better without the drastic measures we had to take .
chicktracy
Is there a list? Its sounds like you are telling people to get more fucked before they can follow your path.
aloysiuscentauri
Well there is a list on page 31 of the book Alcoholics Anonymous but it ends with “we could increase the list [to the end of time].” ...
aloysiuscentauri
...To the contrary, we will try to help whoever presents to us, however, we have but suggestions. I had to try every other method I ...
LordPaimon
That’s not at all what he’s saying. If you’ve never hit rock bottom that’s great for you. But after using heroin for some time I can say...
LordPaimon
... that once you’ve hit YOUR rock bottom you’ll know. Its not about getting worse it’s about being ready to change. It’s such a difficult..
FartsSmellBad
What kind of tautological motto is that? "If you follow our path you won't not follow our path"
AngeloSchilling
More like, "If you don't mess up, then you'll probably succeed!" Still just as stupid.
ahhhhtomzilla
“We’ve never seen anybody fail who followed our rules: don’t fuck up” ?
ahhhhtomzilla
That’s not what it says at all ?
BarbedWireCatheter
I know basically nothing about the program, but it looks to me like “if you dont drink, then you haven’t drank”
lordcirth
Yeah, there's a reason that AA refuses to share their success statistics. Others have estimated an 8% success rate.
HoldMeCloserTonyDanzaaa
Once again, please show me "success rates" of other therapies that aren't studies heavily biased by pharmaceutical companies
AngeloSchilling
Funding source doesn't indicate compromised data, only a lack of reproducibility indicates that. There have been a LOT of clinical studies /
AngeloSchilling
on e.g. Naltrexone done over decades, which all show the same thing, across multiple countries; that's not "Big Pharma" pushing an agenda /2
AngeloSchilling
it's results being validated and consistently re-validated.
AngeloSchilling
Here is one solely funded by the UK DoH and Medical Research Council: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25664494/
aloysiuscentauri
Yes. How do you suspect one would collect that data from an anonymous membership?
AngeloSchilling
they're not anonymous to the organization; just to people around them. The org could easily create aggregate statistics.
aloysiuscentauri
I promise you that the organization cannot easily aggregate statistics.
Tankgirl79
Good job! I'll have 6yrs come September
AanaBon
Omg!!!! Happy early bday ;)
MadoraM
Congratulations!
SalTuscany
That's awesome. I hit 2 years in April. One day at a time.
Tankgirl79
Yeppers. I still dream about the stress of having drugs but not actually using it's weird.
SalTuscany
Yeah. I still wake up feeling that I have a bottle hidden somewhere that the wife might find. It's a stressful few minutes.
1Ofold
24 years july 31st
Tankgirl79
Wow. I can't wait to have more clean time than time used
1Ofold
I got clean when I was 24. It does get way better. my worst day clean was better then my best day loaded.
Tankgirl79
This is so true. Definitely more present in your own life. The hard part is learning how to undig yourself out of all the crap you collected
Tankgirl79
Cuz you were gonna use it some day. Lol. And remember you no longer have the metabolism of a race horse. Oh and how to enjoy
HoldMeCloserTonyDanzaaa
Whoa, me too! 6 years sept 23
Tankgirl79
What! We are twins. Yay for us! I was able to give my old connect a hug and tell her it was my hate for her that helped keep me clean
HoldMeCloserTonyDanzaaa
Thats so awesome!!!
OwMyRupturedSpleen
I mean congrats on the sobriety but 12 step programs, AA in particular are so fucking bad at actually achieving sobriety.
colleensmolleenbitches
Thank you!!
vindik8or
Nah, but don't worry. Those people didn't "thoroughly follow our path".
MuthahMayhem
29 years and counting. I come from generations of this devastating disease. I'm grateful that the miracle off AA has worked for me.
Chunkified
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2020/03/11/alcoholics-anonymous-aa-helps-people-stay-sober-longer-study-finds/5008835002/
AdamSenior
Fuck aa/na
zoeytg
Hah, yea, I think that sometimes too, and I'm a member. ❤
sweetfeetpete
It’s a real problem when applied to opioids. Relapse can be deadly
EnergyFiend
Everyone is different. It's just one type of path. It's worked/saved some of my friends (and none of them are at all religious or anything).
jackieblahblahblah
Many fail because the person hasn't throughly followed the path and maintained a connection with their higher power. Work, work, work
blueshickensrule
That is because success at staying clean is really fucking hard. AA/NA can help, but you also have to treat the underlying issues
OwMyRupturedSpleen
Seems like therapy and medication that makes detoxing more manageable would be great for that.
blueshickensrule
If it a even available. Sadly addicts and alcoholics are not a high priority in ‘Merica
creepingkitteh
Historically AA was low bottom drunks. Now there are people who try AA, who haven’t hit their bottom or aren’t willing to change everything1
creepingkitteh
Which results in lower success rates than early AA. It won’t work for everyone because it’s fucking hard, but it has saved countless lives
Extrovertedmanchild
12 steps to accepting jesus as your lord and savior, because you are powerless without him guiding your way to tithe
zoeytg
I'd like to know where that is in the big book or the 12 steps.
HedonistBeard
Step 2,3,5,6...... I could go on but yeah, it's all about god this and god that.
zoeytg
“came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.” Its my concept of God. I'm Athiest to the Christian god.
zoeytg
If you'd like, I'd be happy to talk more in private messages, conversation is terrible in short comment posts.
RyanSullivan89
Only thing that worked for me
AceBandito
Didn't you read what the True Scotsman wrote on that coin? If you failed, you probably just didn't follow it thoroughly.
HeyArabella
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/
fumpst781
Man, the anger in these comments... I'm a pretty smart guy and tried every "scientific" approach I could, and it failed. AA worked for me.
vindik8or
I've got this tiger-repelling stone I'd like to sell to you.
dragonherder
It depends on the programs honestly. The biggest problem I have with AA is the relgiious angle. Many things and even therapy can fail and
dragonherder
a lot of it is down to if the person doing the stuff wants to truly help themselves or not. A person that doesn't want to help themselves
dragonherder
isn't going to do good with any sort of anything.
DomeGuy
Lots of ways to help addicts fail a lot of addicts, but most ways don't lie and say they're 100% effective.
dragonherder
Almost all programs are 100% effective IF the addicts want to help themselves. Sadly that's what it boils down to.
taytothief
What’s your suggestion?
OwMyRupturedSpleen
A therapy guided program where actual professionals help you come to terms with your addiction while providing medication
OwMyRupturedSpleen
That eases the withdrawal process.
OwMyRupturedSpleen
Having faith in a higher power isnt gonna make detoxing any better. Science however can. AA is archaic bullshit.
OwMyRupturedSpleen
Speculation puts their success rate at single digit numbers. While science and therapy lead programs do far far better.
yinkum326
You’re not wrong. Alcoholism is a spectrum. Doctors don’t even use “alcoholic” anymore. Sometimes AA works for people 1 -
yinkum326
- 2 it creates community. I was in AA, left it. It was a tough decision. But it wasn’t me. It’s too dogmatic. I struggled with happiness.
yinkum326
- 3 labeling something as a relapse when they aren’t addicted, it’s demeaning, and scaring someone into sobriety using rhetoric is negative.
yinkum326
- 4 my sponsors would say drinking again would only end up in death or in jail. I hated that rhetoric. I left, I’m still sober. Just need
zoeytg
You could be right. For me, I was dying, nothing worked. AA gave me my life back. I was taught in AA find what works for you.
blueshickensrule
Exactly, and not all AA groups are created equally.
KatInTheCorner
I'm a social worker who has worked in a rehab. AA has a lot more markings of a cult than anything related to mental health.
ThatMuchForCreativity
I'm thinking any cult can probably replace substance abuse fairly well for some people
AceBandito
I've had clients get driven to court by members who advocate for the judge to order the defendant into their treatment as an obligation.
Lobuttomize
Have you ever read Infinite Jest
KoalaChief
In it. We're aware. Joke about it. Some go in hard for it. Others tread carefully. We all understand it's an imperfect program
LordPaimon
So? A cult that keeps you sober, doesn’t actively take your money and the only thing it worships is sobriety? Didn’t work for me but still..
astrangehop
It it only helps a few people, but is by far the most popular — isn't that to the detriment of everyone who wants a working solution?
LordPaimon
No it’s not because there is no working solution. It didn’t work for me. Did work for my mom so that’s great. Everyone is different and...
LordPaimon
... if AA is the worst cult you’ll ever join that’s a win in my book. I mean it’s literally free. You never have to give anything if you...
zoeytg
You could be right, 12 traditions are why gave it a chance and the 12 steps have saved my life.
HoldMeCloserTonyDanzaaa
I'm a substance abuse counselor as well as an addict in long term recovery. The thing is...EVERY thing has abysmal "success rates". And 1/
fumpst781
You are speaking truth. This is a great comment, and thank you for leaving it!
HoldMeCloserTonyDanzaaa
My issue with success rates is the method of self-reporting. I cant tell you how many times treatment centers called to ask how i was 2/
HoldMeCloserTonyDanzaaa
Doing and i said "great!" While loading up a shot of dope. And how do you measure success? A month of abstinence? A year? A period of 3/
HoldMeCloserTonyDanzaaa
Abstinence followed by a relapse and then achieving sobriety? Its such a flawed system touted mainly for treatment funding or website 4/
Covidnineteen
As a guy who used to work in rehab, almost all the young girls are set up to be victimized, or further victimized.
astrangehop
Pairing them up with ex addicts with no training & little oversight.. what could go wrong?!
Tarmaccian
As someone who's studied the psychology of cults.... ohhhhh yes... Is there's a more dire color for a flag than red?
onlyhalfghost
You can add a splash of gold or a white circle with a funny windmill in the middle?
Hardestpartisfindingausernamethatisnttaken2
Mauve
Sasurau
Bonesy84
I’m curious though, for those that it works for...is it worth it? I’m an atheist and I think any form of cult is bad. But I’m wondering 1/2
zoeytg
I also consider myself an athiest. AA taught me how to be an adult, have integrity, take responsibility for my actions. Be of service.
zoeytg
For many like me, medical community had given up on us. It was the last chance. It was that or keep drinking myself to death. Saved my life.
Bonesy84
This is why I don’t want to crap all over it. It obviously works for some people, And whatever makes it work for you is good. I just wonder
Bonesy84
In terms of harm reduction is this a “less bad” option. But I think it’s awful the state can mandate AA when they are religious in nature
zoeytg
I agree. As a member in good standing, I get one vote, and my vote would be not have that. But we can't tell the courts no. 6th tradition
aloysiuscentauri
I have found AA only works when you are ready. Mandating AA is rarely useful, except to show someone where to go when they are ready.
Tarmaccian
AA replaces one psychological dependence with another, but it doesn't really eliminate the addictive mindset. Whether that's enough for 1/2
KatInTheCorner
It's also why you see devout members defend it so vehemently even given the overall abysmal success rate.
aloysiuscentauri
In my opinion, comparing success rates, is comparing apples to oranges. For most, AA is the last option.
aloysiuscentauri
If you can stay sober (or drink successfully) another way we are happy for you. That was not our experience.
Iwannaseeit
It's the last option because it worked and you stopped looking!Amazing joke, thank you.Reminds me of "I found it in the last place I looked"
Iwannaseeit
I know you're being serious, just saw it and thought it was a little funny. But you do you, I'm glad it's working for you, truly
HoldMeCloserTonyDanzaaa
So what has better "success rates"?
zphobic
They're looking at aggregate numbers. AA seems to work for some people. Some people quit fine on their own. For others, who knows?
tippnasty
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/
dontbesoimgur
This post may have saved my life - I’m going to see my doctor this week to discuss naltrexone
iwenttocollegeforthis
Rehab centers?
LordPaimon
Are you serious? Rehab centers are fucking awful. John Oliver did a piece on it. All I’m going to say is „Florida shuffle“