Spozzkon
145074
5825
434
Hug a man today, and let him know he's loved.
Nov 19, 2019 11:10 AM
Spozzkon
145074
5825
434
Hug a man today, and let him know he's loved.
guitarsandstoke
Love this. Question though- I don’t recall registering for selective service?
rv6502
IIRC In some states it's automatic when a man get his driver license or register to vote he's signed up for it so you may not have noticed.
fairybug
I watched that documentary, and was mostly okay. Then they showed that baby being circumcised at the end. It was unbearably monstrous.
Cheeseme
Thanks for sharing! As a male veteran who had an SO break his nose (we both got arrested even though I was bleeding) I feel this so much
jonnydash
i was just treated like shit by woman my entire military career, not that bad but i cant even have a normal relationship now because of it.
CritterrCatcher
Sorry you experienced that
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
I think people don’t realize how much male soldiers actually are abused by wives. I was an MP and we specifically had to be trained to 1/
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
Expect the wife was the abuser on roughly half of our domestic calls. 2/2
DrjayOBGYN
Holy crap. That is heartbreaking. :(
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
Don't get me wrong, many soldiers and vets who are male are guilty, too, but like the graphic says, they don't get resources like women do.
DrjayOBGYN
That just makes it worse. Domestic violence is a hideous blight, but having to face it alone is worse.
Cheeseme
It was actually right after I got out so it was regular police and not MPs I dealt with. Would have probably been better off it was you guys
ArkoneAxon
All true Feminists are also MRAs, and all true MRAs are also Feminists. Every man is a woman's son, brother, father, husband. And the same
ArkoneAxon
goes for every woman being a man's daughter, sister, mother, wife. We're all in this together. Fighting for the rights of the other gender>
ArkoneAxon
means fighting for the rights of the people you love.
PardusXY
I agree with your sentiment, but many feminists see this as a zero sum game, and they want to control the conversation.
IZ42
I see much more of zero sum nonsense from red pillers/MRAs/MGTOWs than I do feminists.
PardusXY
I mean you’d say that as deflection.
Kenkenny82
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
The only comments that have a problem with this post are already downvoted to hell, calm down.
msgbubba
thats my dad
OngoGoblogianTheArtCollector
man your dad is awsome
msgbubba
stratus41298
I dove to the bottom. It's... Interesting.
Navrodel
99% sure that if they just removed the term "Red Pill", it would be fine. It's good info on real problems, but from a toxic community.
IdiotSavantTinker
From a toxic community? You do realize a former feminist directed that movie?
SecondAccountforDoingOtherShit
This is what kills me. There's real discussion to be had. But the movement is so toxic that it cant happen. Only shouting matches about 1/2
SecondAccountforDoingOtherShit
Whose fault it is. More division instead of coming together to solve the problems. Ignore whats real and fight about made up shit.
Binerexis
This is common when all you see are the extremes are a movement; it generates clicks but not decent discussion.
Someshithead241
Red pill was the title of the documentary for that exact reason. Name any movement or community that doesn't suffer the same pr problem
DorthLous
Made by an active feminist that started out by trying to make a movie showing how women had it bad. Watch it, it doesn't go how she thought.
UbiquitousPixel
How’s it a toxic community exactly?
iamdeathnote
I honestly only learned that international men's day was a thing about a week ago.
DaLongas
Back in 2018 there was a post about a campaing in the UK that tried to raise awareness about male suicide.
planetseven
The veteran homeless % is heartbreaking. What's driving that in particular ? Any charities or funds doing good in this space i can support?
KartFnocker
I fully agree with the importance of many of these issues, so it's a shame to tie it to "red pilling", which looks terrible these days
allcattywampus
Yeah that phrase has a definite middle-school locker-room smell attached to it
ReginaKasteen
So it smells like Axe body spray, is what you're telling me.
override367
I would wager most people reading this don't know that most feminists are also aware of these statistics and tie them to the same root -
override367
cause responsibility for discrimination against women. Toxic masculinity is responisble for your coworkers pressuring you into doing-
override367
something dangerous just as much as it is for a woman to not be considered for a job because she is seen in the worst light possible
PardusXY
Feminists only care when it effects women, if it hurts men, they have to work out how it harms women before they do anything.
override367
That's like saying Mycologists only care about food if mushrooms are involved, and then only in how the mushrooms are involved. It's -
FiftyShadesOfMascarpone
Yeah, they're the definition of concern trolls. "Look at these perfectly valid concerns. This is why we have to turn back the clock to 1950"
ReginaKasteen
"These days"?
KartFnocker
well, incels were benign at first. Started by some lady named Alana. Things change, though
rv6502
Only because the mainstream media made it so. They love boogymen.
KartFnocker
you don't need the MSM to go to /r/theredpill and see for yourself. And yes I know they didn't make this documentary
xKaraKx
Thats the joke
KartFnocker
Idgi then
flyingfishstick
xKaraKx
Funny is subjective. I personally LOVE the reaction this gets
jasari
It's part an attempt to spin gender inequalities that hurt men into anti feminism by saying feminism is anti men, which is not true.
godskook
An attempt by Cassie Jaye, renowned **FEMINIST** documentarian.
jasari
machiavelli can call himself a humanitarian but does that make him one?
BirbJammin
No but promoting feminist ideas for most of her life and winning awards for it is a good start.
godskook
Cassie Jaye wasn't just self-identifying as a Feminist, she was a **FAMOUS** award-winning feminist.
EternalAzhrei
It's different from the red pill community, and it states that very much. It uses the metaphor from the Matrix, not from those people.
EternalAzhrei
It being the movie. = P
DarklordIIID
But those people did the same. It's unfortunate that there isn't a real movement on the progressive side for men to align with. Almost 1/
DarklordIIID
universally any pro-masculine bent group also trends hard into the alt-right, MGTOW, Incel spaces. It's not healthy for anyone involved. 2/2
buttery1
As a feminist, I am completely here for men talking about the real shit they deal with. I hope y'all have the love and support you deserve!
PardusXY
There are those of us that can “cross the isle” and work together, but don’t take our criticism of your movement to be a criticism of those-
PardusXY
who are like yourself, many of us understand those like you exist, but to us you seem to be the minority.
Butane9000
Old employee of mine was living in a storage unit and gave his kids to his brother to avoid his wife and protect his kids since she was >
Butane9000
Wanted in connection for a murder. Dude sold his house and almost all of his belongings to live in squalor to protect his kids. I ended up >
Butane9000
Adopting his dog so he'd have a better home. Eventually his wife was arrested in another state shacking up with a different murderer. Once >
Butane9000
She was behind bars he was able to reunite and live with his kids. Though he was hospitalized for a few months after that for the toll it >
Butane9000
Took on his body. The entire time he was in court trying to get stole custody among all the other BS she didn't pay a dime in child support.
Eddi3v
Jeeeze .. international mens day is depressing
TheSpeakerOfTheHouse
Happy International Men's Halloween. Just wait til women's day, when women count their blessings and appreciate how safe civilization is.
Shewy92
Is the documentary The Red Pill related to the subreddit r/theredpill
EternalAzhrei
It's not about the redpill subreddit or movement, it's about the MRA movement, and her subsequent realisation that reality is other than 1/×
EternalAzhrei
Has been presented to her in feminist views. It shares the same metaphor from the Matrix, but ignores r/redpill as much as it can.
drakewarnock
It's literally called The Red Pill. They obviously weren't trying too hard.
DorthLous
A feminist starts out documenting her journey to try to discredit the movement. Now watch it and make your own mind, don't let bias in.
SirSkellingtonBonerLord
the documentary is very good, the subreddit i can't say because i've never been there... i mean... it's a subreddit what do you expect?
PardusXY
The terminology is shared, and the red pill comes from the matrix, both movements use the term.
solaer
Hey, check this out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMU-YjVGiGs
Daviater
No, they're both based on the metaphor from the matrix though. The doc is about men's rights from a feminist perspective
drakewarnock
Feminism is men's rights from a feminist perspective. It's about equality and they fight for men's rights all the time.
nevoreJunkie
She was a feminist journalist who wanted to investigate the red pill movement. Its worth a watch to see her journey
CyborgScribe
You mean was paid by them to make a propaganda piece. I like how she never bothers to confront any of their controversial stances.
CyborgScribe
It's all "you guys say men have dangerous jobs" and not their all women want to be raped or the age of consent should be 12 stuff.
somerandomtwat
that because she talked to real people of the movement not just the most extreme person they could find
AstarothMagus
and how often do you see radical feminists being taken to account on their controversial stances without being called a sexist?
PardusXY
Only female feminists get to criticize other feminists, don't you know the rules?
nevoreJunkie
I don't think any of the people she talked to thought that
godskook
"related" in the loosest sense, yes. The subreddit was setup by a branch of the movement, but isn't the movement, and the documentary 1/?
EternalAzhrei
Wrong. That is so wrong. The movie is NOT about the redpill movement. It's about the Men's Rights movenent, which is MUCH different.
godskook
The MRM are part of the redpill movement. Lots of them talk about their "red pill" moment.
godskook
Example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGT26MpSXNs
EternalAzhrei
That is still DIFFERENT from the redpill community, you dope. Red pill moments are waking up frim the Matrix, r/redpill stole that idea.
godskook
is about the movement, not the subreddit. The subreddit is also mostly PUA hookup culture, rather than what the larger movement is about 2/2
wylwrk
Where's the special YouTube video recommendations commemorating the occasion?
ChewyChewbacca88
My SO was gaslighted first 13 years. He has worked remarkably hard with support and now he is recovering and we are working on his best life
wozat
I am not an international man. Do these statistics still apply?
SomeOneHasBeenLookingForYou
I mean, the military part is kind of a red herring. Women weren’t allowed or were regulated to auxiliary/support roles. Which, in context 1/
06cpayne
KIND OF?! hahahhaha.
SomeOneHasBeenLookingForYou
3/ men in general (being disposable) which might be the more core issue...
ArtSmarse
Being disposable sucks, but is to be expected. Biologically speaking, for every mammalian species, it's the males that fight. We're 1/
ArtSmarse
built for it. There is no aspect of combat for which men don't (on average) have a marked advantage over women. 2/
ArtSmarse
It sucks, but that's life. 3/3
SomeOneHasBeenLookingForYou
2/ is “normal” b/c military service was a male-role. Doesn’t justify the defectors sacrifice/go die for us mentality that gets pinned to
Silvertine
Also women are more discouraged from going into the military because of the underlying abuse going on, that occurs for both men and women
MajorNikon
Not a red herring. What you mention is the whole point encapsulated.
DVSBSTrD
Then why does it compare the ratio of female veterans to male veterans?
MajorNikon
Because that directly relates to issues that directly affect veterans, like homelessness and suicide.
DVSBSTrD
No it doesn't.
MajorNikon
ReverseCard
What if I told you you can be conscious of both sides problems without negatively affecting each other. Also down with social constructs.
somerandomtwat
thats what this is about. ive not seen many people who say that men are the only ones with problems but ive seen lot saying
somerandomtwat
women are the only one with real problems and act like saying that being a man can be worse in some ways is taking away from womens
somerandomtwat
problems.
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
But that doesn't enforce my view that half the world is against me! What am I supposed to do, fight the media who are actually at fault!?
DaveTheScientist
Don't worry, we're not downvoting your point, only the annoying and immature way you made it.
fortlotus
Precisely. Most people are reasonable. It’s only the assholes who get the megaphones/headlines. Extremism gets more clicks than reason.
JustARandomStrangerOnTheInternet
Nothing in this post negatively affects the other side. Saying "we need help too" does not take away from help already being given to anyone
ResplendentCassowary
something something privilege, equality feels like oppression, etc. Don't expect empathy from this sort.
usersubbordercontrol
Social constructs are moronic
stratus41298
I'm glad someone else said it. I love the information, but it did seem awfully man vs woman. "they do it too!" is not an excuse IMO.
somerandomtwat
man vs women? cna you explain what about it gave you that vibe.
Neptuneflyer
I'm not sure how you can present these issues without showing the comparison. It works the same way when you point out the wage gap
Neptuneflyer
domestic abuse rates, percentage of women in power, percentage of women in CEO positions etc. In a binary system it's always a comparison.
Baurge
When did it ever say they do it too? It was more of a it happens to men too. At one point the fine print even said that it wasn't trying 1/?
Baurge
to downplay women effected but highlight that we can't act as if men are immune to such things (the part about sexual abuse.) 2/2
godskook
This movie was made by a feminist.
sammypup
And when she started, she thought the movie was going to be very, very different.
godskook
Yup, cause she had journalistic integrity to listen to people talk rather than just pre-judge them.
sammypup
If I remember right it did leave her with severe depression for a while too.
Galdrack
The film is also incredibly misleading at many points.
Jesterr
It has an agenda, and a bias. Facts are presented to support those. Nothing false or fake, its just a typical modern documentary.
Galdrack
Not really, say the Vietnam or Attenborough docs are accurate and clearly present info with as little a bias as can be. RP constantly>
Galdrack
misleads with its info and will drop info on the topics when it suits the narrative it's telling. Its even misleading in what it's bias is.
godskook
Cheap words, and not true.
Galdrack
Accurate words, very very true.
godskook
Thank you!
TrapsAreIllegal
The Red pill doesn't believe in that.
Chesslover
The reddit red pill doesn't. But the true red pill is to know the world can be shit, and to try to create a better you in spite of it.
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
Yes. I’m 1000% for addressing this issues but I do not support The Red Pill.
DorthLous
Did you watch the movie? It only has that name in reference to the expression, because it was made by a feminist out to point female issues.
Throrf
The movie or the "movement"?
DigiT00l
I felt this post was that, inform about often ignored male problems, most people know about the female problems
Galdrack
It doesn't though. It's directly making a comparison like some kind of competition rather than just directly pointing out the issues.
TurtleExMachina
Male social problematics. Posted on International Man Day. How strange indeed
DigiT00l
That's how statistics work
Galdrack
No it's not. Laying out stats on murders doesn't require a comparison to deaths from drowning. That's a nonsense statement bud.
candiduscorvus
That’s exactly how female issues are presented too.
Galdrack
That's because every single time women post about issues effecting them MRA's add "but what about men" at the same time it's only since>
Galdrack
the prominence of such comments issues on domestic violence have included comparisons.
override367
In the class I learned about feminism from in college I also learned these statistics. I feel like the internet portrayal of feminism -
override367
as a bunch of shrieking pink haired harpies is incongruous with my experiences of people trying to make society better. They tie the -
somerandomtwat
the word does not have nay meaning tbf. ive seen people with the exact same opinions call themselves feminist, anti feminist
somerandomtwat
and neither. it become more of a social tribe than a ideology.
override367
root causes of structural sexism to the same thing that causes men to get worse prison sentences or be pressured into danger or not share -
somerandomtwat
the problem is that "they" dont. its such a broad turm that means very little that it includes insane
somerandomtwat
misandrists alongside people that activly just try and remove unhealthy social issue specific to one gender.
override367
their feelings and end up killing themselves. Thing is, a shrill 3rd waver gets signal boosted by a hundred right wing youtube channels.
BirbJammin
Maybe but how does that relate to feminist abuse shelter policies actively hurting men and boys and this not getting proper criticisms.
SaneBrain
One example of the explicit needless comparison is 73% of all suicides are male, vs. men suicide 3.53x more often than women.
NeoGenus59
What is needless. Those numbers arent related if men outnumbered women 100 to one, 73% would be a low density of male suicide..
SaneBrain
You would give a rate, i.e. 13.34:100K, which is the real rate. Suicide is #8 at 2.5% vs. Heart disease & cancer making 47%, so hi dens, no.
EternalAzhrei
If you go see the movie, you'll understand why comparison is a large factor that can't be ignored in these issues.
SaneBrain
I watched as much as I could stand of the whining. Are there differences sure, but the stats are cherry picked. like sentence length...
SaneBrain
... men generally are more violent. Men muggers do more pistol whipping.
SaneBrain
The ones I do think should be compared or really added is sexual molestation and child custody after divorce because those are crossover pnt
SaneBrain
MEN have not allow women in dangerous areas. Rate of death is .6% dwarfed by heart disease/cancer. This movie has no perspective.
SaneBrain
Men for years told women they could not serve so those are not valid & men serving actually fought allowing them, so blame that on men.
SaneBrain
As for circumcision up until recently it was thought that the upside was greater than the downside. recent studies have reversed that.
SaneBrain
Veteran homelessness is the people of the US allowing the Republican Party to forsake our promises to all vets. That's on all of us.
SaneBrain
And I don't think anyone has seen suicide as a major women's issue because of this easily derived ratio.
somerandomtwat
people talk about suicide in general and its not that targeted towards men. im not sure where you are
somerandomtwat
getting this "no one is taking women suicide seriously"
SaneBrain
/1Discussions of suicide at support lines always note the difference in rate and the higher actual follow through, I don't know of anyone...
SaneBrain
/2who down rates this for men. Men are KNOWN to use medical and support services less and be more resistant to others advising the use. ...
DogenutsDoughnuts
Interesting info about suicides, particularly the difference with lethality. I feel the rise of LGBT has helped men come out about 1/2
DogenutsDoughnuts
Our mental health, sensitivity and femininity in men is more accepted now than ever. 2/2
Metaljugger
And yet suicide rates among trans women are sky high. Regardless of your guesses why, I don't think that helps men at large.
Somanyquestions
I read the difference in lethality is because women tend to favor less "ugly" ways of dying as to not be a mess to find for their loved ones
MistressLyda
Personally, I also suspect that women tends to have less impulsive suicides. Planned suicides are easier to hide.
CreateYourOwnNormality
Also 7/10 US men have access to a firearm, while only 3/10 women do.
omnipotentpasta
People are dying of circumcision?!
Volensblood
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6412606/
MajorNikon
Much more common 2-3,000 yrs ago, but still happens today.
stopbeingakissass
infections?
SaneBrain
yes. there are usually other unknown conditions with clotting.
NaivePulp
I got an infection when my parents decided that was the play. I also was born with a heart murmur so rough start to life I guess
dogestyle
Sometimes it's even worse than death: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Reimer
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
RadlanJay
People are getting circumcised?
Sauroctonus
I don't understand why. Don't their tips get cold in winter?
ImgursLibertarian
Mostly because they are infants and they can't voice their dissent.
disagreeable
*still
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
RadlanJay
Nice try shill. HEre's rest of the quote: but the benefits are not great enough to recommend universal newborn circumcision.
RadlanJay
final decision should still be left to parents to make in the context of their religious, ethical and cultural beliefs.
EternalAzhrei
There are also BOTCHED circumcisions. Boys who will never have sex because someone cut too much off. Watch the Red Pill movie, it's worth it
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
stratus41298
Very low rates, but it's happened.
fairybug
Which, for a completely unnecessary cosmetic surgery, is far too often.
loopyloopus
There is a mortality rate, generally lumped into SIDS. Lots of other nasty side effects as well. All around a barbaric practice.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
memepatrolofficer
https://www.doctorsopposingcircumcision.org/
PterodactylSpicyKurbis
https://www.netflix.com/title/81000861?preventIntent=true
Imalwaysready
People die from everything. They are weak, fleshy things.
TimTheEnchanter01
They’re made of meat
rhombusrightangle
Yea, my flaccidity due to a gentle breeze
Mechame
only 100/yr. 2018 had 3,788,235 births, assuming half are boys and all are circumsized, that's 1/20,000. Still seems a bit high.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
ragekritz
Tiny baby not a lot of blood, bleeding could be dangerous or get infected. It's a tiny percentage but the risk is just not worth it
magicmegaman
They have it done when babies so can't use pain meds so some die from shock from pain others from blood loss hidden in a diapers
MistressLyda
Of course. It is a open wound in an area that is rather moist and warm, done indiscriminately on how able the parents are to care for it.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
MistressLyda
Yes, I am aware of that the official conclusion in USA differs from most European countries,
MistressLyda
and is more in line of the conclusion in areas where it is common for religious reasons.
areibold
Most Americans are not getting it for religious reasons, but for reduced cancer rates, reduced std rates, reduced infection rates.
EnokMolkeHansson
moist, warm and inside diapers full of poo if we're talking about infants.
Wombatish
The paper that very roughly estimated that rate doesn't even meet Wikipedia's quality standards as a source. *Paper link below*
Wombatish
The 100/annum paper: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/240804903_Lost_Boys_An_Estimate_of_US_Circumcision-Related_Infant_Deaths
Wombatish
A much better one: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2835667/ (1 life-threatening hemorrhage in the US but 0 deaths)
PterodactylSpicyKurbis
3 of my friends boys almost died bc the dr cut wrong, hit artery or vein, baby bled too much. Intact is best. Nothing wrong with foreskin!
pr0nty
Geez. The first two almost died and they STILL went for a third?
PterodactylSpicyKurbis
3 sep friends. All on an Air Force base. Had to be ambulanced to a German hospital after mil dr messed up.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
PterodactylSpicyKurbis
Male genital mutilation. Only 1/3 of world population cuts. Reduces sex pleasure. Watch American circumcision on Netflix.
areibold
Yeah I’m not going to trust a proganda based Netflix series over my doctor and the entire American Pediatrics Association
PterodactylSpicyKurbis
/a/sQ0CNti
PterodactylSpicyKurbis
A look at the debate surrounding non-religious infant circumcision in the United States, with interviews with experts on both sides.
flarflarf
about 100 babies every year. It's insane we still let people do it imo.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
flarflarf
you omitted the other part of the quote: "however, existing scientific evidence is not sufficient to recommend routine circumcision."
caine224
I would guess this is similar to deaths from vaccine complications. Not a lot, in other words
rexkraft
Vaccines are neccesary, you are arguing that dying for the sake of a prettier dick is an acceptable risk to take
flarflarf
yes, 100 nationwide is not that many. But its from complications arising from cosmetic surgery, which should raise a bunch of eyebrows.
caine224
There is at least some tiny risk involved in any surgery. Making policy from extremely rare negative side effects is always a bad idea.
flarflarf
it's cosmetic surgery. I don't think it's ok to allow parents to perform cosmetic surgery on their infants.
rv6502
Yes, newborn baby boys are dying from male genital mutilation. About 100/year in the USA. In many cases diapers absorb the blood till death.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
rv6502
Sure, that opinion has nothing to do with the amount of money they make from the operation and from selling the foreskin for stem cells.
areibold
Stem cell research? I didn’t even know it went to that, sounds like not only health benefits (cancer/std/infc), but also scientific benefit
rv6502
We could harvest other optional organs too. No infant needs 2 kidneys, let's take 1 out for scientific benefit. "His body, fuck his choice."
rv6502
There is no health benefits from circumcision that would otherwise cause death if uncircumcised and plenty of death if done.
areibold
Cancer?
areibold
Yes but it’s like focusing on how 100 people died during a type of surgery that saves or improves hundreds of thousands of lives.
whenifinallyscorewithmarieantoinette
Except circumcision doesn’t save or improve lives, it’s just a religious/tradition thing.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
whenifinallyscorewithmarieantoinette
“but the benefits are not great enough to recommend universal newborn circumcision.” - AAP
areibold
Universal, of course there are exception, but it’s still an acknowledgement the HEALTH benefits are there and worthwhile compared to risk
CrusherOfCities
America circumcises boys out of tradition, not for health benefits. Its original purpose was to prevent sinful masturbation. Most of the 1/2
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
CrusherOfCities
2/2 studies (with few minor exceptions) claiming any health benefit have been debunked or disproved by other countries' health services.
DrGlug
How on earth does it improve lives? It's barely done in Europe and we're all fine
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
HurtYou
Except circumcision doesn't improve or save hundreds of thousands of lives. What's the valid medical reason to get it done?
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
HurtYou
You're missing the rest of the quote: Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision 1/2
HurtYou
outweigh the risks and that the procedure's benefits justify access to this procedure for families who choose it, 2/3
Sauroctonus
Only valid case I've heard of is when it's too tight and causes pain.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
rexkraft
however, existing scientific evidence is not sufficient to recommend routine circumcision. - AAP
nevoreJunkie
Usually those orthodox versions where the mohel sucks on it too remove the blood etc
awesmond
Wait what the fuck? Is this for real? I am not googling this to find out out of fear of being added to some kind of nasty list.
nevoreJunkie
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/herpes-babies-jewish-circumcision-ritual-link-rabbis-infants-a7620446.html
omnipotentpasta
Yep. Whoever came up with the idea to chop baby dicks for god was a real pervert
Thornaxe
Desert culture, basically no hygiene, circus were to prevent disease. They worked fairly well, but soap works pretty well too.
nevoreJunkie
The rest of the world's population didn't seem to be ravaged by penis rot
Thornaxe
*circs
tp3115
Yes but 100 infants a year is not even remotely statistically significant. That’s a routine surgery risk.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
kodiak931155
And if i wanted yo cut my childs earlobes off it would also be minor surgery with minimal risk. And also abuse
areibold
So stupid to ignore the health benefits
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
tp3115
I never said I agree with the surgery. I just don’t think the death statistic is relevant to the debate when put in context.
EternalAzhrei
Right, but this is not a routine surgery. This is a surgery rendered medically unnecessary by today's hygiene standards that STILL gets 1/2
areibold
Wrong and stupid “Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
EternalAzhrei
2/2 practiced for non-religious purposes. It's a risk of life for aesthetic, or due to misinformation. And people don't care or are unaware.
tp3115
I meant routine in the sense they perform it regularly. I never spoke to whether or not I agree.
EternalAzhrei
Fair enough.
candycoatedbats
Like all surgeries, it comes with a risk. I'm not risking my future son's life so he can have a "prettier penis"
DVSBSTrD
What about a "prettier" throat or a "prettier" intestine?
fairybug
Perhaps I'm ignorant, but I'v never heard of cosmetic colon or throat surgery.
SaneBrain
Actually once investigated by scientific studies, lower infection rates from a large group of STD emerged. but overall may not be enough.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
zombiejedediah
Smaller penis as well. Less wanking in adolescence makes is smaller than its full potential.
ImgursLibertarian
Source?
fennecbutt
This is not true (I'm gay and I've seen many, many dicks). The whole "black dicks are big" thing is mostly a myth as well tbh.
areibold
I have NEVER heard anyone use this justification. Pediatrics associations says benefits outweigh the risks medically.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
RNeao
Very rarely is it medically necessary anyways. It's mostly just NA associations advocating it.
awesmond
Curcumsized or not just wash your dick regularly and you'll almost certainly be fine.
areibold
It’s not just hygiene but circumcision reduces cancer and STD rates as well.
KingdomOfDimensions
I think they meant that tongue-in-cheek. In reality, all medical benefits from circumcision are easily attainable without the procedure.
areibold
The reduced cancer rate? Nope, not all of them.
kodiak931155
I have
GotBannedForPostingAYoutubeLink
Do you have that backwards? Cause afaik there are exactly 0 benefits of having your dick mutilated at birth.
areibold
Reduced cancer rates, reduced STD rates, less infections
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
ImgursLibertarian
We looked into it for our boys. The "reduced risk of infection" is only accurate for HIV in Africa. It reduces risk 6%. For HIV. In Africa.
Irreal
Generally people who think they are protected also tend to do more risky things, which can outweight the protection.
Wolfradimus
IIRC That is exactly what happened. HIV cases skyrocketed in Africa because people thought they were immune and stopped using condoms.
DVSBSTrD
Why would it reduce the risk of catching a blood born STD?
areibold
Yes
pr0nty
HIV is transmitted via semen as well as blood.
DVSBSTrD
Oh shit. Then what you need is a condom.
ImgursLibertarian
less foreskin means less surface area for small abrasions and more likelyhood of the liquids being held between the foreskin and glans.
DVSBSTrD
You'd still have to be pretty rough with it for those to even be a possibility.
BobbieNell
We live in an industrialized nation with high standards of hygiene. Circumcision is completely unnecessary. And risks outweigh aesthetics.
Pyrolime
But what if I don't want to explain smegma to my son?
areibold
It’s not aesthetics. It’s reduced cancer rates, reduced STD transmissions, and reduced infections. The AAP says there are health benefits 2
Imalwaysready
Even in an era where a lot of women's first impressions are the unsolicited dick pics men send as part of the modern courting ritual?
BobbieNell
As a woman, my opinion is that the sending of unsolicited dick pics in no way assist men in the modern courting ritual.
Imalwaysready
I would agree. I grew up old fashioned. We had to do dick Polaroids, which was a lot more personal memento. Romance is dead.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
BobbieNell
"but the benefits are not great enough to recommend universal newborn circumcision." You seem to have left part off.
areibold
like most surgery. Benefits outweigh the risk, but it’s got to be a parents choice to look out for their child, just like vax complications
SaneBrain
That was a fairly recent study and reversed what the AAP had stated up until 2017, science moves on using the best tools at the time.
Butane9000
There's actual medical reasons for circumcision
Josiahkf
nope. just like people claimed mutilating girls in a similar manner was for medical reasons. thankfully that's phasing out much faster.
Butane9000
FGM is horrific. Removing some excess skin from a penis isn't even close to the same thing.
ImgursLibertarian
Not all Female circumcisions remove the clit. Some just all the unnecessary skin of the lips and clittoral hood.
Nykidemus
It is horrific. Inhumanly so, but they conceptually similar.
Sauroctonus
No, there are actually medical conditions that are solved with circumcision.
ImgursLibertarian
Source?
WinstonSmith101
e.g.
fairybug
I heard a girl argue in favor of it for hygiene reasons once, because she believes it's literally impossible to teach boys to wash.
areibold
“Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks” -AAP
fairybug
What benefits do they cite? I honestly can't think of any, so I'd love to be better informed and -- if I'm wrong -- change my mind.
areibold
Reduced cancer rates (penile), reduced STD rates - less chance to both transmit or receive, reduced infection rates, and more
fairybug
Isn't that reduced STD rate in the low single digits, and only applicable to Africa, an only to one STD? And by what rate is cancer reduced?
ResplendentCassowary
I just start saying "no penis, no opinion" to them at this point honestly.
fairybug
On the one hand, you're a genius and that's perfect. On the other, I'm not a fan of disregarding opinions based on genitals.
rv6502
Yup, because it's soooo difficult to get boys to repeatedly pull their foreskin in the shower... *eyeroll*
fairybug
I don't think I made that argument at the time. I wish I had -- I'd've loved to see the look on her face.
rv6502
Re: "it's cleaner":studies on FGM has shown too that in some forms it reduced UTIs. No ones would accept FGM even with "proof" it's "cleaner
fairybug
Wait, what? How? The clitoris and the urethra may be n the same neighborhood, but how would no clitoris = fewer UTIs?
Sauroctonus
After not having a working shower for a week, I don't know how anyone can go without washing.
MisanthropicAnthropoid
Yet somehow you can teach them to wipe their asses properly.
fairybug
That's one of the arguments I used. She disagreed. There were even men in the room who I used as examples. She was still adamant.
Sauroctonus
I have heard of men who are afraid to wash their arseholes in case touching there "gives them the gay". Hopefully they're a minority.
fairybug
Oh dear fuck, that's stupid. I agree, I too hope (and think) they're a minority.
rv6502
Probably big overlap with flat earthers and other fringes.
MisanthropicAnthropoid
I know the type of person. Best just let them be.
kodiak931155
No. They sgouldbt be given a pass for being willfully dumb and ignorant. Theybshouldnbe ridiculed and motivated to stop
fairybug
Exactly what I did. Haven't spoken to her in years. It was a friend-of-a-friend situation anyways. I'm just glad to be rid of her.
ausernamewhat
Can confirm, my mother and sisters were put into a shelter back in 2000 and my brother and me were not allowed to even go inside the shelter
thefar
Hijacking top post. Sorry. So we're all gonna ignore that this is a "the red pill" post?
ImgursLibertarian
No. The RedPill movie is NOT r/theredpill.
thefar
Oh thanks for the clarification. My bad.
Ruudeboy
My mom took me and my sister to a woman's shelter when they split up, I don't know the details, but he didn't know where we were for weeks.
LanceDevon
Mother was abused when I was 13, my 2 brothers and I were not allowed to spend more than 3 hours at the shelter.
LanceDevon
Luckily my mother was tough one, she rather be with us than at a shelter.
MrStarkLord
Jesus dude
Mozzeltoff
I don't feel like woman only shelters are an issue, but there should be more male shelters or mixed available for those who need them.
iamamentat
They are if they are turning away sons who are trying to stay with their moms.
Mozzeltoff
Hence why 'mixed' should also be available. For many, safety concerns in general prefer single sex shelters. Both for children and adults
iamamentat
Makes sense. I'm all for getting people help. It's just sad to see some of these comments about families splitting because of those policies
PunchyFromCleveland
I don’t agree with not letting children in, however the women that are there are scared and are usually there because of an abusive man,>>
PunchyFromCleveland
2. men being there can make them feel unsafe.
TroyLoModel
I’m a single father and I can confirm getting custodial roasts of my son was hard but only because my ex wife fucked up horrendously.
TheM00SE
Same. My Mom, Brother and I fled from my abusive father. Turned away at shelters because my Brother was 12.
amoeba15
It's bullshit. I'm so sorry you had to go through this.
TheM00SE
You know, I think we all grew closer because of it. I’m thankful I have a family that cares so much for each other.
GrizzlySaint
I volunteered at a shelter for abused women, the male children teenage and up were added to the exterior guard duty.
[deleted]
[deleted]
freshthrowaway1138
Gonna need a citation for people protesting a men's shelter. Homeless shelter protest I've seen but never anti-men protest
MrFancySmancyPants
https://globalnews.ca/news/1676642/controversial-centre-for-men-opens-in-toronto-amid-criticism/
freshthrowaway1138
FTFA: "Theriault says she has no problem with shelters ... or counselling services for men but say’s CAFE has a “pretty poor track record.”
Eidusloemus
Hold up. People do what?
TheM00SE
Things are good now. Mom met step dad who is a good man. I’m now married with a house of my own.
TheM00SE
Slept outside for the first week or so. Then slept in a car for the next year.
justadudewholovescats
USA?
TheM00SE
Yeah USA.
texasdean
Thats messed up
Acrossbetweenabunnyandeeyore
That's life. For so many people.
dav3nasty
Threeleggedcow
Everything with a penis is an abuser apparently
nateglen350
I abuse my penis daily, as a matter of fact , I’m fixing too right now.
MajorNikon
To be fair, it's not abuse if it asks for it.
Snooj
Or can take care of itself.
edenyxia
I'm triggered
DVSBSTrD
Yeah, not like being around penises might make a RAPE victim uneasy.
fairybug
I know a female rapist. TIL she has a dick.
DVSBSTrD
Is it you?
fairybug
You know, I have to give you credit: it took me til just now to realize you're a troll. Seriously, congrats. You're really good at this.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Threeleggedcow
Its not hyperbole. This literally happens all the time. The bias is real, burying your head in the sand doesn't make it any less real.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Threeleggedcow
Read the rest of my comment chain. I'm not talking about twitter fuckwits, im talking about the real life police force.
Threeleggedcow
When my dad beat the living shit out of my mom and the neighbors called the police guess who got arrested when they showed up? Me!
Threeleggedcow
27 year old male got arrested just because I looked similar to my dad in appearance. He took off and was only arrested hours later after I
Feralkyn
It's not that. Until you see the disturbing lengths that domestic abusers/stalkers will go to, it's hard to understand why they can't trust
Feralkyn
that someone might just be claiming to be a victim to get -close- to a victim. But there should absolutely be more shelters for men, and
WraithTDK
That sucks and all...but telling a 12 year old kid - a kid who's likely as much a victim as the woman - that he has to...
WraithTDK
sleep outside in the car because of his sex? For all the screeching people do about victim blaming, that's bullshit.
Feralkyn
places where families can go, for sure.
superfuzzbros
It's one thing to not allow an adult man in, but these anecdotes are about shelters not letting in children with their mothers. He was 12
Feralkyn
It's about both, and adult men -also- need a safe haven, honestly. But yes, I agree that 12 is a little young for a cutoff.
tzap
If I imagine myself being a woman, coming from a neighbourhood where cat calling is the norm and where I've multiple times gotten 1/?
tzap
harassed, and I got raped by some big dude who effortlessly overpowered me, I could see myself not wanting to be around many men while 2/?
Duendes
I see that you're trying to be compassionate, however, don't set other people on fire for somebody's preference
tzap
I'm trying to cope with the initial trauma. 3/3
Jandegrote
Right and enough woman have caused trauma to so why dont you go sleep on the street and leave the shelter to men ?
EternalAzhrei
That's why they want more shelters for men. They highlight the issue of trunaways so people understand the situation.
Bahbawhitesheep
So the children should sleep outside to give you peace of mind?
Ryukaa
Now imagine being a raped man and be "completely left out to die in a ditch"TM!
BelleofdaBall
So all men are rapists? Are all Muslims terrorists too?
TrapsAreIllegal
They're not men, they're children.
RandomnessSlayer
I feel both sentiments. But turning a man away in a similar situation seems too extreme when there may be nowhere else to go.
thefrompleman
turning away kids though? and that's not really the issue here, it's that there's no suitable alternatives for men
realskramz
It sucks that men don't have enough shelters but can't blame women shelters dor it since many women in there might feel unsafe just being
ausernamewhat
I don't harbor any ill will, I understood there position.
rgzdev
Except that the lobbying groups that manage women's shelters actively campaign against male shelters they don't control. They even attack...
rgzdev
...them IRL. A feminist even killed the dog of a lady who managed a male shelters. There's just too much money on female victimhood.
realskramz
Citation needed
realskramz
in a building with men tbh. Same reason why many feminists still argue for keeping gendered toilets.
foximillian
I mean, I'm a feminist, and I argue constantly for eliminating gendered toilets. Make one big bathroom where everything is stalls.
waudey912
As a bloke I agree with gendered toilets. People can be self conscious if they have issues particular to their own gender.
Steven054
There's literally no reason to have unisex bathrooms that aren't private/single occupant.
rockjock29
A 12 yr old boy is considered a man?
sammypup
There should be wiggle room allowed for the children looking for shelter with their mother though.
realskramz
I would assume the same but we dont know the situations and the conditions of the people inside so it should really be case by case imo
ragekritz
A 12 year old isn't a man that's a child.
tomyironmane
"Separate but equal" all over again. Welcome to the new Jim Crow.
CreateYourOwnNormality
https://nypost.com/2017/10/29/these-shelters-help-male-victims-of-domestic-violence/ There aren't shelters for men, too low volume, the
CreateYourOwnNormality
Domestic abuse charities rent hotel rooms as needed instead. About 9% of people in need are male, but the number is rising, so actual
TheDayTheBrainStoodStill
Men deserve love and respect. Men, however, don't deserve the red pill movement.
somerandomtwat
the problem is that it got misrepresented by the media because extremists get more clicks and then anyone half reasonable
somerandomtwat
disassociated themselves with the term and now mostl thats left behind are the extremists.
TheSpeakerOfTheHouse
I feel it should be rephrased: men shouldn't be made to feel they need the red pill movement.
ThatNoPicklePeeThatNoPumpARum
It's literal garbage of a movement they don't need it at all.
rockjock29
TheRedPill, while filled with a massive amount of douchebags, does have some great foundation thoughts and literature.
sammypup
It's just a whole lot of digging through pure bullshit to find the foundation.
rockjock29
I'll give you that. But it's that way with pretty much any such philosophy.
PardusXY
The red pill movement isn't related to the red pill movie, it's just an unfortunate title.
SidneyHarbor
So is this movie any good? I saw her TED talk but didn't know if it's worth spending the money on Amazon to stream it.
SeaHutch
It's interesting, though it's premise needs to be taken with a grain of salt since the film isn't very critical.
PardusXY
Honestly, it's common sense 101, but having it as an infographic is not as good as having it as a movie for the laymen.
Zangakkar
It's pretty good, it can get a little raw though fyi.
SirJiffy
It's bad that the first I hear about it being International Men's Day is on a imgur.... a predominantly meme centred website. 1/2
DukeDarkwood
It's amazing how many people find things out here before other places. It's even happened to me a few times.
SirJiffy
Not hating on the post, it's good it's posted. Just speaks volumes that it's not published more on other formats. 2/2
stratus41298
I didn't even know we had a day, so Im not sure it's common knowledge. Or maybe I live under a rock. Who knows.
RNeao
Last year some ppl were annoyed that Google didn't have a doodle for it, since they'll do one for such random stuff. Nothin this year either
ilovebees
Really? I've seen it in a number of places. Twitter, Reddit, a couple of mailing lists. Maybe you need to diversify.
verdenvidia
i dont want to be on either of those websites if my life counted on it, barely wanna be on here anymore people are so toxic
ilovebees
That's fine. If you only ever go on imgur though, you can't really say "it's sad I haven't heard about this yet".
PrincessNausicaa
I heard about it because Facebook posted the London Underground's Men's Day sign/
Somanyquestions
It's also a predominantly men centered website (around 80%), so I'm not surprised to see it here first.
DukeDarkwood
I would argue that's not by design, just a reflection of overall Internet demographics.
Somanyquestions
Nah, different websites have different demographics. Tumblr and Pinterest are mostly female. Facebook is much closer to 50/50.
DukeDarkwood
And yet I would still argue it's not done by design - imgur doesn't seem to be made to foster this proportion; it just ended up this way.
Somanyquestions
Agreed, it's not by design, but also not because it's general Internet demographics.
Somanyquestions
Though, the fact that it was used as a place to store all the smut images from Reddit probably did help get a lot of men in here.
Caffynated
The imgur census from a few years ago shows 49% female/47% male.
Somanyquestions
All the sources I find put it around 80 male. https://expandedramblings.com/index.php/imgur-statistics/
[deleted]
[deleted]
Somanyquestions
Odd, works when I click it. Anyway, looking up "Imgur demogaphics" all results are pretty similar.
Somanyquestions
And with the amount of half naked girls that used to be on FP every day, I highly doubt half of users are women.
yesThatIsOnPorpoise
Funny how all these statistics also list the female rate except for the sexual abuse and assault one. ...maybe funny's not the word I want.
F234K
Either a woman or a brainwashed beta.
yesThatIsOnPorpoise
Got to scrub those brain lobes, they tend to get all mucky.
ArkoneAxon
That would be "what-about-ism." You can care about the suffering of men AND care about the suffering of women.
yesThatIsOnPorpoise
I'm not sure it is, since what is pointed out is a lack of comparison where the rest did get comparisons.
somerandomtwat
i think its more about how most of these are worse for men but also sexual assault is still a issue for men even tho its overlooked and
somerandomtwat
never talked about
NotWelcomehere
the difference is men is 1 in 6 and women is 1 in 4 as far as I can remember. So for every 1 dude molested an extra half a woman is molested
DamnedAustin
Yet the same people who throw around the male statistic will vehemently deny the female statistic and get defensive about false reports.
aesthesia1
They will also tout racial crime statistics from white supremacist sources but get angry if you mention that 90% of violent crime is/1
aesthesia1
Committed by men, or that white men get lighter sentences than black men, or any study that chalks any advantage whatsoever to being/2
aesthesia1
White and Male such as the study on job call backs affected by race and crime record 3/3
NotWelcomehere
And those people are assholes. I don't think it helps to assume that those venn diagrams are circles though...
CyborgScribe
Those people are the subject of the documentary used to make this fact sheet. One of the guys interviewed in the documentary has said that
CyborgScribe
he doesnt see rape as a problem and would never vote guilty to put a rapist away even if perfect proof existed. Women sexually serve men
Antrazit
Can we stop pitting males and females suffering against one another and accept that everyone is discriminated in some areas, and benefits in
somerandomtwat
i agree with the sentiment heer but this post did not do that. it just informed of areas that men suffer from discrimination.
Feralkyn
I'm a woman, and I didn't really see this post as pitting anyone against each other. These seem to me like issues that just aren't well-
Feralkyn
publicized or discussed enough, and it's perfectly fair to air them.
DigiT00l
Only when male suffering is seen for the issue it is
Maxmar
This. Its not about men vs women its about both genders' problems getting the attention they deserve.
EternalAzhrei
You need comparison in many of these to see the difference. It would sound fine to know men sign up to go to war unless you also knew 1/2
EternalAzhrei
2/2 that women didn't have to go. Same with who gets the kids, or who gets shelters. It exposes the severity of the issues. That's all.
SidneyHarbor
This doesn't pit anyone against anyone. It's highlighting that men can suffer to and shouldn't have to suffer in silence as society wants.
cheshirecat00
Well this post wasn’t to compare to begin with it’s just information to know how so we could find solutions to help each side better
Azothan
It brings up more men serving in the military but.... we didn't allow women 4AWile and still do everything to discourage them from serving.
cheshirecat00
I’m sorry I’m not getting your point, can you revise what does that have to do with this comment?
Azothan
It has to do with the image/information. Claiming it is unbiased is silly when it's making points stemming directly from limiting females.
cheshirecat00
I don’t know the suicide rate, the small amount of men shelters,& the sexual abuse/rape static’s don’t seem to be limiting women but 1/2
BenSnow97
Yeah, it sucks that every time male issues are talked about people HAVE to compare it to the female side. Who is that fucking codependent?
moto192834
Isn’t the same true for the other side too? Wage gap, % of people in power, etc issues are almost always comparisons
Galdrack
Well wage gap genuinely can't be explained without a comparison, but feminists didn't start making comparisons about domestic violence>
Galdrack
until people kept asking "but what about men" everytime they made a statement on it (you still see it anytime a comparison isn't made).
Antrazit
Others. Just take a look at what you are working with and go make yourself into who you wanna be. Then, each one teach one. One love.
NobodyWorthThinkingAbout
No. The whole issue of a "men vs women" divide is to keep both sexes too busy fighting to see who's really at fault. Classic strategy.
Antrazit
And who would that be?
NobodyWorthThinkingAbout
The rich people, who benefit from those below them being too disunified to fix anything.
Antrazit
Ah yes, the devilish rich people. Simple, isnt it?
NeoGenus59
Teaching comes from reading things like the poster... whereas preaching comes from people like you!
Baurge
This post isn't meant to put on against another. It's meant to being to light some issues that often aren't talked about and should be. 1/?
Baurge
You comment is a perfect example of how bringing up men's issues automatically makes it seem like they're trying to discredit someone 2/?
Baurge
If we're not allowed to talk about men's issues then how will we ever work on overcoming them? 3/3
Antrazit
Are you familiar with the term "red pill"?
JimmiRustler
We won't because the world's shown that they won't. People on the net mostly only care about virtue signaling
zoidburgerandfries
Some of these statistics seem designed to prove a point rather than reveal one - 99.9% of combat deaths being men is related to not ....
imperfectregulator
yeah that's because there's lies, damn lies, and statistics, basically you can make stats say whatever you want
zoidburgerandfries
60% of this is true, 100% of the time
Nadyanilo
Same with the aspect of male workplace deaths. They die in male dominated industries. Of course there's going to be more male deaths. Skewed
Nadyanilo
It would be the same to say that more women die in childbirth than males.
Logwarrior999
Talk about it on Women's Day.
LaforgeMRA
Male deaths from suicide are based on method. Men tend you shoot themselves more often, women often try with pills.
JonnyTightlips
And women actually attempt more often but WTF cares, it's a major issue, regardless of gender
LaforgeMRA
Also, anecdotally, men seem to do more idiotic dangerous shit at work than women
aesthesia1
Uncomfortable truth is how often men in dangerous jobs shirk safety precaution.
riderofthepurplesage
Not just at work, we do more idiotic, dangerous shit period.
zoidburgerandfries
Allowing women to serve in the military until recently, and not in combat until 2013.
BobbieNell
Yes, but isn't this kind of the point? This IS a uniquely male issue because of the male-dominated military. Same with PTSD & suicide.
RichardDragaLong
Read the asterisk.
Zombraina
I still think that isn't a fair comparison. They've been allowed in for 3 years and the women who do join up are subjected to sexual 1/
Zombraina
harassment and sexism when they do go in along with all the other bs, because it's dominated by men. Who wants to go through that?
RichardDragaLong
No one, just saying his concern was addressed in the asterisk ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
RichardDragaLong
Or her
Spozzkon
The combat deaths is a point to emphasize the sacrifice men have to give in society. The point of Vietnam is the draft was not volunteering
dogestyle
I feel the true root problem here is actually how the US treats its military, and especially its veterans
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
I’m a female -combat- vet. I volunteered so men wouldn’t be drafted. I wasn’t allowed into combat, but I was sent anyway (willingly). The 1/
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
way this info graphic treats the veteran issue is extremely problematic. Being in the army was my first real exposure to sexism. I was 2/
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
sexually assaulted (more than once) by fellow soldiers, including my Team Leader. I was ragged on for PT standards I didn’t set. I come 3/
zoidburgerandfries
If only men still need to register for the draft, sure, that seems uneven but it’s apples/oranges to imply sacrificing is unique to dudes
cheshirecat00
Actually law states now at 2020 all women the age of 18 have to register for the draft as well due to female military members complaints 1/2
cheshirecat00
But if your over 23 already they stated you don’t have to 2/2
Neptuneflyer
It's still an injustice that faces men, I don't get why you are turning it into some competition.
zoidburgerandfries
I guess it irks me when people make ridiculous claims. Also, I can turn things into a competition better than anyone
AstarothMagus
Thank you for showing you did not read the entire post because if you had, you would have noticed that this was brought up and addressed 1/2
AstarothMagus
in the fine print under the statistic. 2/2
zoidburgerandfries
Adding fine print that counters the giant misleading headline “facts” only scores my point.
zoidburgerandfries
Also, the deaths due to circumcising , thats an odd point. Plus compared to female circumcising deaths worldwide and there is no comparison
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
I think it's a bit more U.S centric, since hardly anyone genitally mutilate their female children, that happens more in the middle east.
Irreal
Of course comparing the deaths in the US of one to those of the other world wide gives the world wide one a lead.
Spozzkon
That isn't the point. We aren't disregarding the horrors women face. We are emphasizing the pains men face
[deleted]
[deleted]
Spozzkon
Took someone long enough to get into my post history. Men have to make their way in the world just like women. Men just face different risks
zoidburgerandfries
The graphic does state “uniquely or disproportionally” so my point is pretty valid. I mean, you don’t need a Men’s day to underscore ...
zoidburgerandfries
... everyone gets fucked in life.
SqueakerBot
I mean, it's from the red pill, so it's kind of meant to disregard women. This is the community that claims men have no agency in society.
ADisturbinglyAttractiveCactus
Once again, and god do I wish she'd called it something else, but her movie "The Red Pill" has nothing to do with r/redpill. Nothing.
Imalwaysready
Yep. That name alone is a giant red flag for most things.
WeAreTheBearsWhoSayBangarang
So i think this is important. Extremely. But the comparison to women is unnecessary. The fact that it happens at all is what needs to be 1/2
EternalAzhrei
If you were just told that a lot of men had to sign up for military service, it might not make it through to you that that is unfair, 1/x
EternalAzhrei
Unless you also knew that women did not have to do the same. You might simply think "this nation values their military highly and has 2/x
EternalAzhrei
found a way to make sure it has soldiers." The comparison at NO place says that women have it easier, in fact, it goes out of its way 3/x
EternalAzhrei
To show that women also have a difficult problem in suicide and domestic abuse. Any judgement on women or their situation that you read 4/x
EternalAzhrei
In those words, YOU read into those words. YOU decided that was the context, not the writer. Read it again without it, you'll see. 5/5
PatrikLilja
"highlighting these statistics is not in any way meant to downplay domestic violence against women. It is however, intended to add to the1/x
PatrikLilja
growing conversation that anyone can be a victim of domestic abuse and everyone who needs protection deserves 2/x
PatrikLilja
access to it" How can you that and respond with " We have to stop caring about who has it worse" 3/3
DamnedAustin
It helps to know the history of Redpill. It's toxic AF.
EternalAzhrei
The Red Pill movie is not r/redpill. Conflation is not beneficial to anyone here. Stop it. Do better.
KingdomOfDimensions
I've seen countless infographics just like this for women that were entirely comprised of comparisons to men. If this one makes a couple w/e
baconandeggsminustheeggs
Just 1 day, 1 fucking day. Happy dudes day my dudes.
WeAreTheBearsWhoSayBangarang
fixed, not because it happens more to men. We have to stop caring about who has it worse & start caring that it happens to anyone at all. 2.
MajorNikon
I think the point is there's so many who want to make it a zero sum game to the detriment of everyone.
stratus41298
Yeah but we love that argument! It's timeless. :)
TechnicallyRight
It becomes important to compare when the vast majority of resources to serve these issues is so widely yet solely available to women.
TechnicallyRight
That's why when women lobby for things they compare what they have access to versus what men have access to. Everyone matters.
TechnicallyRight
Pointing out discrepancies helps show disparity
TechnicallyRight
Same coin other side. Everyone matters.
watdefuqBoi
It’s probably worth noting the group that it affects disproportionately. Given, the presentation of those stats sounds a little snarky lol
Imalwaysready
Preach. But some people have to make EVERYTHING a competition.
Throrf
I agree. But that means we should be consistent and stop talking about "women's issues" and "men's issues" and only talk about "issues".
WeAreTheBearsWhoSayBangarang
I wholeheartedly agree. Im sick of being supposed to care because of the category of person it affects. I just care b/c someone's life sucks
ShutTheFrontDoors
I absolutely, 100%, agree this is important. However my first thought with the workplace deaths statistic was that it’s probably caused 1/
mistersaIvage
I was thinking that too, but there was a disclaimer in the footer on that part of the info graphic.
ShutTheFrontDoors
There’s a footer about military deaths, I saw that, but I don’t see one about workplace deaths?
axiomatik
I’ve seen more women in traditional men’s jobs lately, working on a road crew, on a tree service crew, for a yard service, all this summer.
axiomatik
In the past, these were more physically demanding, requiring a lot of strength, but with modern power tools/equipment that’s less the case
Ruudeboy
There are several things with this. Education level is one thing, in general, more women are being educated in non labour related jobs 1)
Ruudeboy
Women are (in general) better at going to school in the way schools are now. Statistically, men are more present at the extremes of 2)
Ruudeboy
IQ scales, so there are more lower IQ and higher IQ men, the lower IQ take what jobs they can get, which is typically labour heavy. 3)
Ruudeboy
And therefore higher in risk of workplace injury/death.
ShutTheFrontDoors
Interesting, i’ve never heard the IQ thing. Do you have a source for that, perchance? I’m not doubting, just honestly curious.
PardusXY
Not adding a source just yet, but just context, in evolution, men are the "random factor" and women are the "control", so women tend to -
PardusXY
gather closer to the middle of the IQ curve, men are nature's experiment.
ShutTheFrontDoors
By the choices men make on what job to take, just like the wage gap is caused by the choices woman make on what job to take. I could be 2/
Quasipickle
There is no "wage gap". There is an "earnings gap".
ShouldersDeepInAHorse
I wish more people knew the "wage gap" isn't women paid less for the same job, it's just an average wage taken across the country.
SaneBrain
Wrong. the originating data is by job, but researchers noticed that the difference is pretty standard and that is what is reported.
PardusXY
There are 1000's of sources that disprove what you just said, at this point if you still believe that, you are willfully ignorant.
SaneBrain
Yeah, looking at the data and how it is collected is being willfully ignorant. Can you send me a valid source? I would be happy to read.
SaneBrain
The comparisons of pay are within the same job, NOT as an aggregate. What is overall is that percentages holds for almost all jobs.
AstarothMagus
NO! The 77% wage gap that people like to prop up is an aggregate. It compares the earnings of all men to all women, regardless of their 1/2
AstarothMagus
actual job. When taking into account hours worked, occupation chosen, education and job experience, etc. The pay gay closes dramatically 2/2
SaneBrain
/1 BTW, it's closer to 82% now, but most economic studies in the area use data collected for like jobs by labor departs for compliance...
SaneBrain
/2 and controls for everything you bring up are used. HOWEVER the overall population is large enough to show a good median/mean ...
xKaraKx
More dangerous jobs pay more. Men are expected to be bread winners. Simple asthat
SaneBrain
Asshate, not simple, the comparison is by job not by aggregate! Male clerk vs. female doing exact job in insurance makes 27% more. BY JOB.
somerandomtwat
a lot more you need to take into account rather than just job title
SaneBrain
Researchers have normalized for that. Yes, variance occurs but is controllable, they also allow for other vars like, time-in-job +more
SaneBrain
Note the is not anecdotal evidence, we are talking a HUGE population with real statistical validity. Variance does and SHOULD occur.
realskramz
Not really true. I would assume many injuries come from low paying unsafe construction jobs where women wont be employed even if they wanted
somerandomtwat
they could be employed in it, if they wanted it.
xKaraKx
Low paying construction? Where are you?
realskramz
I would assume many jobs construction, machinery, warehouses still underpay while cutting safety costs all around the world tbh
hardytardigrade
There are also biological differences between men and women.
Matsuuu
Yes, but what jobs are those that needs to be done by man?
xKaraKx
None. Just jobs that require strength, which men have a higher likelyhood of having
hardytardigrade
No job needs to be done by either sex, unless it's sex-specific. But some jobs have physical demands that men are more likely to meet.
ShutTheFrontDoors
Wrong, I have no data to support thiS. Either way some things definitely do need to improve for men. 3/3
MagiicHat
This is why they are paid slightly more.
lestasi
gender paradox: as societies become more gender equal, men and women become more different in certain aspects, rather than more similar.
Matsuuu
Many accidents happens because rush, not following safety instructions and dumb choices. And work(place) culture affects to those. 1/2
Matsuuu
Gender difference I can guess 2 reasons: Men are majority on fields with higher chances of accident and men ignores safety more often /2
Jandegrote
In my past jobs men get the harder jobs with more risk just because they are men woman could say its to hard and get a easy light job.
Spozzkon
You arent wrong. If you choose these job you take on risk. But there 2 points to consider. Someone has to do this job. Women dont want them.
AvatarTommyBee
.. you could vote for Bernie ... or jerk off about all the "risk you're taking"
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
Women don’t want them? Statistically they simply aren’t hired, whether they want them or not.
ReverseCard
Women don't want them cause they'll just be bullied because it's 'not womanly'
Somanyquestions
This. I know plenty of women who went into "male" field because they loved the job itself, but quit due to constant harassment.
ShutTheFrontDoors
It’s still a choice though. If men decided they didn’t want to take them, then the law of supply and demand stipulates that the wages 1/
Spozzkon
These jobs exist because things like mining is a necessity. And so, we couldn't operate without these jobs
ShutTheFrontDoors
Would rise until someone was willing to do it, be it man or woman. I guess my point is it’s still a choice. Some jobs are always going to 2/
Deleteded
I find it interesting that this is immediately met with a bunch of downvotes. And people wonder why men kill themselves more often.
CarlottaVonSprockett
If it soothes your soul, at this time it has over 1,100 upvotes and only 82 downvotes. Not even 1/10th.
MexicanFrenchCanadian
Welcome to the western hemisphere... In addition that those facts come from the Red Pill community.
CyborgScribe
The Red Pill is a terrible source and members of that movement have some terrible and misinformed views. It's hard to upvote their stuff for
CyborgScribe
me. All their pro-rape stuff. Their weird sexual marketplace stuff. Stay in the kitchen bullshit. They represent the worst in men.
CyborgScribe
These guys https://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/ohio-student-called-false-rape-accuser-hiding-school-article-1.1495081
BronxMahoney
TIL downvoters are serial killers
QuiGonChuck
Yes, men kill themselves more often because of all those downvotes. jfc...
Jandegrote
The world care's even less about this then they do about HK.
Imalwaysready
Because of online downvotes?
vybafnout
Definitely because of those downvoted, you solved it.
jasari
I think the downvotes come from the source which is know for it's faulty criticisms of feminism.
TisIChenoir
You mean a movie made by a feminist woman with the original intent of showing the true (bad) colors of the MRA, but ended accepting them?
Imalwaysready
Yep. The Red Pill is a terrible and often misleading. Even if the information in here is accurate, it is often partially presented & biased.
Typingthroughchaos
Cutting off nose to spite the face? Sure, let's do that.
unitoMemeJunkie
All these bad comments actually highlight what Deleteded means. Raising men's problem awareness is frowned upon
Baurge
It really is sad to read how many people are taking this as an attack on women or see this as a men vs women issue.
Deleteded
I never heard of the red pill, I don't know about their reputation, all i know is I see people ignoring the issue to say fuck them
Baurge
Same here and I want to watch this documentary now because comments I've read of it online seem to fall into two camps, either it's good 1/?
Baurge
in its attempts to being to light men's issues or that it is devaluing women's issues. 2/2
WC2ElectricBoogaloo
Because a certain faction in the west cannot, for the life of it, admit that sometimes men suffer more. Its all tribal. Upvote for you.
DamnedAustin
You're an example of why people downvote this post. Thank you for your service.
WC2ElectricBoogaloo
In what way am I an example? Id like to be entertained with whatever point youd like to make.
DamnedAustin
Because much like this post, you seem utterly incapable of advocating for men without shitting on women/feminists. Wrong target, dude.
WC2ElectricBoogaloo
Whoa, I found the problem. Women and femenists are not synonymous, and that kimd of thinking seems to be the only reason femenists still 1/
Sainare
Youhavinagiraffe
It's because it's presenting men's issues as being in opposition to feminism when it isn't. The toxic masculinity concept is all about this.
Nagodreth
Like the military stats, presented as if women were getting a free pass when it was men that were barring them from military service.
Imalwaysready
Yep. As a man myself, some of these points and goals I agree with. The tactics and how they spread the message I most certainly do not.
aesthesia1
Yes men kill themselves because this post got downvoted
Grummbles27
I got downvoted once....almost killed myself because of it.
NecroticWords
Counterfit
25 people want you to try again, I guess
VibratingNipples
Are you still there? I see at least 12 downvotes
Grummbles27
It's okay, I ate an entire rotisserie chicken, so I'm good for now
Sionas
What bunch of downvotes? You have mostly upvotes on your comment, as does this post...
DimwitF
It's because of the redpill part for me. MRA incel dipshits don't deserve an upvote.
Deleteded
When I first saw the post, there were more downvotes than up. Obviously it's changed since then.
Brutsarge
Considerably.
Anonawesome
As of now, that comment is the oldest by ~15min. We didn't see the post in usersub, so maybe it was downvoted first.
Deleteded
Thank you.
faultysage
EVERYTHING is downvoted first in usersub.
RadicalLeftist
Its needlessly pitting men against women. Both have some unique and some broad problems that dont require this sort of comparison.
WC2ElectricBoogaloo
They require this comparison when there is a significationly loud faction of people who compare men and women constantly, and always find 1/
WC2ElectricBoogaloo
Women suffering more, somehow, in every situation. 'Men die in combat, women most affected', those types of people. I don't like playing 2/
WC2ElectricBoogaloo
Oppression Olympics more than the next stoic, but when comparisons are forced into half the pop. that half can freely compare back 3/3.
RadicalLeftist
Then rise above. Why compare just become some other assholes compare.
godskook
Except it's not pitting men against women or pitting anyone against anyone. It's highlighting low-visibility issues.
RadicalLeftist
Look at the domestic violence shelters part. Thats a direct comparison
godskook
Yes, and there's a difference between "direct comparisons" and "pitting people against each other", especially when we have a consistent 1/?
godskook
problem with feminists getting male DV shelters shut down. 2/2
nevoreJunkie
And the gender pay gap and domestic abuse and sexual aussault figures pulled out on women's day don't do the same?
faultysage
See the thing is the only thing posted here on International Women's Day is stuff about International Men's Day. It's kind of funny actually
Dustorn
Or is that the only thing you look for? Because I've definitely seen an infographic just like this, but for women.
faultysage
No. And check the comments on those posts. And they never make it to front page.
76Tromboners
Yeah, it’s not a competition of who has it worse. People are people when you remove gender.
RadicalLeftist
Yes but that infographic is designed to make you upset men get less then women.
Baurge
Why is it bringing up issues men face automatically pits men vs women? If we're not allowed to talk about things how do we fix them? 1/?
RadicalLeftist
Because the post brings up how men have it worse then women in a lot of these categories.
Baurge
The part in sexual abuse even states it's not trying to discredit anyone else's experiences just that it's trying to bring to light that 2/?
Baurge
men are facing these problems and they shouldn't just be ignored. Ignoring these problems is how many of them got so bad to begin with. 3/3
RadicalLeftist
But it keeps comparing to women.
themightymellophone
I think women actually tend to be more suicidal. Men tend to actually commit and follow through on killing themselves more often (i think)
unitoMemeJunkie
Women use attempted suicide as a cry for help more often than men. Using poisons and such after dropping hints in hopes that someone notice
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
No. Women don’t want to leave a mess or a horror scene, is the leading theory
TheDoctorCrankenstein
It says this is the graphic. Women attempt suicide 2x more than men, but with less violent methods like poison/OD, where men use firearms.
01010101011100110110010101110010011011100110000101101101e
So men are better at suicide basically
Typingthroughchaos
Hiss hisssss!! How dare you?! Hssssss
Deleteded
Personally i believe that the success rate says a lot about how committed a person is to ending their life.
Imalwaysready
Personally, I believe you are wildly uneducated on the topic and have an opinion based on a hunch over studied facts, then.
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
The leading theories are than women are 1) conditioned against violence, and 2) don’t want to leave a mess or a disturbing scene for others/
IamMelonLordeYaYaYa
/and 3) care significantly more about the funeral and having an open casket. 2/2
darkdragonempress
Not necessarily. Men use more violent means because yes they want it done. Women will often think of the after effect. How their body is 1
darkdragonempress
Going to look or who’s gonna have to clean up if they made a big mess. 2