mibakr
342011
9026
864
Internet should be a right like clean water
Feb 5, 2017 10:24 AM
mibakr
342011
9026
864
DebarsieDey
Good idea. But would the media corporations then be breeding houses of government propaganda then?
Quasipickle
I believe Norway is set up this way, and Canada is moving that direction.
diabobical
So you're saying Flint Michigan shouldn't have internet?
Leithoa
600 baud is still internet.
TedMales
Yes because just imagine how great a Government owned Iphone would be. Think 3 pounds, 20 minute battery life, and costs $7000.
JohnFisher89
you could argue that do you really want the government controlling the internet?
Drwowcow
Haha the Internet should be a right? That's a little entitled.
therealch3
It's so important and vital to an honest government that we should let that government control it. great idea!
Wildcat0202
How bout not? Like I need another government run service in my life.
LumburgOR
Yeah, Like we have a "free market" right now.
SomeDetroitGuy
I don't know where you live but I don't trust Donald Trump to run my internet service.
northhole
Then they never would have been built...
OneSlaadTwoSlaadRedSlaadBlueSlaad
This. If there is no choice there is no free market. You can't choose your network, only your service provider.
ajizzle
Lmao then it wouldn't work is that what you want?
Ssssssssssss
I'd rather put the focus on clean water.
Zahnradfee
Why not both?
Ssssssssssss
Finite budget and resources, the fact that clean water is a far more important undertaking.
Zahnradfee
As a society, both the USA and Europe have more than enough money and resources. They are only concentrated at a few people - mostly those >
Zahnradfee
people who control things like water and internet.
Clockworkdancerobot
Maybe if people and businesses were held accountable when they mess up water(Flint), or steal it(Nestle)... but business is too intertwined.
Geo80
I have zero faith the government would be the slightest bit more ethical in running it.
cogitoro
But somehow loads of faith in corporations and businesses. It's like "hey, my dad let me down, so I'm gonna' go live with a pedophile!"
Geo80
If there's proper competition, ensuring which is a valid role of government, then yes, corporations are held far more accountable.
MistressLyda
Lesser evil.
Arsenal4725
The price of fiber is going to drop heavily over the next several years thanks to Google and Microsoft getting into the game.
M98E
Give people/organizations like Obama, Trump, and the NSA control over the internet? No thanks; I will pay my ISP fair market value.
hwatL4bloopy
So less than what they're charging you now
cogitoro
"fair market value" is a nonsense concept when applied to something like the internet
M98E
"Fair market value" is a nonsense concept when applied to an asset controlled by an organization with 500,000 gunmen.
JudgeMentalCat
*clears throat* Commie!
LumburgOR
Is Comcast your idea of a free market?
JudgeMentalCat
Lol dude I was saying it jokingly. I'm a socialist, for reference.
JudgeMentalCat
I just know from experience that even reasonable ^like this post^ thoughts that suggest public ownership of services
JudgeMentalCat
tend to meet that response in most places. Goodness knows I get it often enough, and I live in a blue state.
Darthmone
So is food, check out Venezuela grocery stores go see what happens when the government controls everything.
cogitoro
Check out Somalia for what happens when the government controls nothing and fears the power of the people.
wandermanspacebot
Look to Scandinavian countries to see how it works out when the gov't controls certain essential services. But I guess overreacting is ok.
vondruke
it's all or nothing. Right?
Mithi
corrupt government
Clockworkdancerobot
Venezuela is what happens when you bet your economy completely on a volatile resource (oil) and lose. Also too restrictive financial policy.
Darthmone
Not at all, it is what happens when the government decide what price should be, how much food you can buy, besides many other thibgs
Clockworkdancerobot
I didn't hear they were that meddlesome. Only that the low oil price hurt them greatly, and restricting access to dollars made business flee
Darthmone
Relying the entire economy on oil didn't help, but they are the largest oil reserve in the planet, so there is a lot of bad government there
Clockworkdancerobot
The price of oil did take a big dive. it hurt Alberta really bad with the price falling as well.
Clockworkdancerobot
And I grant you bad governing, They promised a lot, but restricted trade in dollars in a way that made companies just up and leave.
Ragnarok1030
Yeah sure, let the government take it over and regulate the fuck out of it and ruin it. Good idea.
ArcaneConjecture
Like they ruined the highways, military, ports, and fire protection? 'Cause the government does a better job than Comcast.
razark
"Your house is on fire? We can have some out there to look at it on Tuesday between noon and 6 PM."
ArcaneConjecture
That sounds more like a private-sector cable company making an appointment to install service.
cogitoro
Okay, since we can't trust the government, let's sell it off to businesses! Government are the enemy, boooo! Corporations are our friends!
wandermanspacebot
Good luck with that. They're already trying to privatize our school systems.
RenegadeTQ
Or...you could look at how awful public schooling is and say "you want that for the internet too?"
wandermanspacebot
I guess, if you like comparing things that aren't even remotely similar and then drawing conclusions from that comparison.
RenegadeTQ
Public control goes the same in any field you'd like to compare
tarataqa
If our prisons are going private, the schools are the next logical step. Soon there will be no countries, only Corporation loyalty.
TheBretters
That's a pretty big fucking step. Also privatization of schools is a tad different than the prison system.
tarataqa
Please give me a powerpoint summary about how prisons are any different than public schools...
TheBretters
o.O holy shit really?
tarataqa
http://img.pandawhale.com/post-34817-Princess-Bride-Vizzini-Im-wait-mw2q.gif
FlintstonesChewableMorphine
Ever watch Continuum? Shows a future world with the corporate congress. Gets far fetched but some scary foreshadowing for the future
tarataqa
yeah, I read/seen some sci-fi stories with that kind of plot. Asteroid miners usually get screwed over. :\
FlintstonesChewableMorphine
The Expanse is a really badass show about that type stuff! Corporate earth, military mars, asteroid mining belters. High production value
FlintstonesChewableMorphine
Also it's based on a book series if you prefer reading. Leviathan Awakes I believe was number 1. Up to 6 now, planning 9 books
ssdoomcraft
I don't know. I'm of the mind that the less the government controls, the less fucked up it will be.
ArcaneConjecture
Your mindset is wrong, and unsupported by evidence.
Clockworkdancerobot
Problem isn't who has control, but who holds each group accountable. Business or govt, if they are not, they abuse power.
IronicUsername
Yeah, that's what the telecoms argue so that they can maintain their de facto monopolies and undo net neutrality too.
whyteraven74
So explain to me why in 2017 living in Chicago I can't get a fiber connection. Meanwhile if I lived in Paris France I'd have 3 choices.
theworldlylie
Companies don't want to spend the money to build over existing infrastructure. If you have coax that can get you gb speeds why change?
whyteraven74
Well if you put TV on that coax you have to compress the signal which means lost quality. Plus fiber runs equally fast in both directions.
theworldlylie
I work for a telco I'm just saying that's their mindset. We have 90% fiber and the other 10 is coax. We can't justify the cost.
mibakr
I can follow your argument. But is it the reality, if you look other places in the world?
shartsicle
I'm in France, and we have public networks with private providers. It has turned internet service into a commodity, but internet access 1/
shartsicle
into a monopoly service. Now the government has the power to tax the access, and has threatened to use it, and to shut it off for some 2/
shartsicle
individuals r providers in dispute status on taxes, or who have outstanding government debts, etc. It has turned internet access into a 3/
shartsicle
bargaining chip over which the government holds all the power and the little guy holds none. Plus, now the gov has the ability to spy on 4/
Blamblam101
It's a battle between incompetence and greed.
mibakr
You have a really good point there.
FlintstonesChewableMorphine
Least we kinda vote in govt. corps choose the power
fake1user
My water system seems to be fine.
cogitoro
Well that's just straight-up fucking wrong.
biolologist
Except that in reality the exact opposite is true...
rodeopenguin
Food is really important too, but every time that gets publicly owned everyone starves to death.
captlush
Yes. Seems to me, keeping the Internet private means keeping it out of government control.
moose9377
Not really, because anyone can grow food, if necessary. Not everyone can set up a worldwide communication network.
cogitoro
Internet access is less like food and more like air. There aren't different flavors of internet, there's just the internet. But 1/2
cogitoro
by all means, since you're one of those "guvment ruins everything" dudes, why not leave air quality control up to private industry? 2/2
rodeopenguin
Air is non excludable. Internet is very excludable. Also internet comes in varying speeds and bandwidths. Your analogy is terrible.
AVoiceOfReason
An analogy isn't necessarily terrible because of extraneous features. If I say "this beer is like sex on a canoe," that analogy isn't (1)
AVoiceOfReason
made worse because the beer is liquid and the canoe is made of wood. Analogies are about comparing one feature to another feature that (2)
AVoiceOfReason
is meant to convey understanding. In this case, they were saying that internet is essential like oxygen. And that's hard to argue with, tbh.
governmentgavemeagun
And delivery methods. City fiber, remote area homes need satellite, sparse towns use wireless, old towns copper wire, campuses microwave etc
BattloidKouji
Yeah, and that way we could have ISP competition. I'm tired of charter's local monopoly and their ridiculous prices.
SwaglortSeal
That would mean zero competition, though, the government would own it all and you wouldn't be able to buy a package&provider to your needs.
BattloidKouji
Sorry, I wasn't clear, I want the government to own the wire to the house, so that any ISP I choose can give me internet access through (1)
BattloidKouji
instead of charter owning the line, and only allowing the charter ISP to use it. It's a virtual monopoly. (2)
thundercactus
I pay much more for competitive private insurance with worse coverage than I did for public monopolized insurance. See the thing with..
thundercactus
government owned insurance, is that they're absolutely required to have a 3rd party audit of their books every now and then to make...
thundercactus
sure they're not actually make more money than they should be.
Slamtastik
I lucked out, our local internet is amazing (especially compared to Comcast) they are called Buckeye-express
dwilson0725
Ohio?
Slamtastik
Correct, moved all around when I was in the Air Force and everywhere else is either comcast or no better than comcast.
dwilson0725
I'm in the Massillon area, so my only choice is MCTV. Luckily they're a really great ISP.
ScratchyFaceMcScruffyBeard
I guarantee you that there are other providers in your area, but charter is the only one that has invested in the infrastructure to 1/2
ScratchyFaceMcScruffyBeard
2/2 provide reasonably fast speeds. So why shouldn't they get paid for the investment that they have made?
RenegadeTQ
There would be NO competition, OP is talking centralization...'cause that always works out so well for communist countries
TurboDave
Sometimes cooperation works better than competition.
HurtYou
Right now they cooperate to keep prices high, customer service shit, and speeds slow....no thanks.
TurboDave
It works both ways. Obviously private companies can cooperate to screw over the consumer, but public organizations can cooperate for the--
TurboDave
benefit of everybody. Libraries sharing books are a decent example of this.
Xplode441
In whose interest is it to set prices between competing businesses when you can set your prices lower and get more sales?
cogitoro
"Reduce government involvement in a commodity, and it'll increase competition!" is the biggest fairytale I've ever heard.
Randyw8483
Cable companies have a monopoly because the government gave them a pass. Otherwise they would be forced to compete
jackpkmn
This right here, most areas where only one isp is available is because they have a contract with the city to keep competition out.
Churlish1
No it was originally to help recover the cost of the infrastructure investments and allow the ISP to gain market-share. It became a monopoly
jackpkmn
No that's the line they fed the cities to get them to agree to it. the "it's not worth the investment unless we can rape your wallets"
johnvictor
Telecoms are an example of why that's a myth.
mibakr
I can get internet though cableTV (one company), 4G (10 companies) or ADSL (20 companies)
mibakr
And one company though radio modem.
phonedog365
Where do you live that this is possible? In my city of 500k+ we have cable(1), DSL(1), and 4G(x). Fast, slow, and expensive.
dwilson0725
I can get satellite internet or one cable internet provider.
Xplode441
The problem is that local governments basically extort cable companies for money when they try to lay cable. Which is why cable companies
Xplode441
raised a commotion when Google stuck a deal to lay lines cheap. Google basically said to a city that they were thinking of laying line
Xplode441
and hyping everyone up so the local government really were between a rock and a hard place, either to appease their constituents or extort
Xplode441
Google to lay their line, and many let Google lay the line which forced cable companies to step up or lose in that area.
Xplode441
tl;dr for my replies, government actively hurts internet speeds in your area.
yoshigg
The toughest thing to work around is the duplication of infrastructure. Maybe have g'vnt maintain that to a degree and auction the bandwidth
Tonberryc
That's what making Internet Service a public utility actually means. Not these strawman comparisons to DMVs and roads.
yoshigg
As long as companies have to use public land to bring the service, it HAS to be maintained by some policy.
BattloidKouji
That's more or less what I'm talking about, there's no competition because there's really only two cables going to your house, dsl and (1)
BattloidKouji
coaxial.
yoshigg
So, you're saying allow private companies to lay line (fiber, etc.) on public land? I'm not saying it's a bad idea, just tough to execute
BattloidKouji
No, I'm saying that the lines themselves are a public utility, and any ISP can give you service through them.
AngriestViking
Best thing in the world is when Google fiver came around. Even the places that don't have it yet the providers all the sudden have awesome
tarataqa
fiver? I just wanted tree fiddy.
AngriestViking
Internet speeds. I currently have 300 mbs for pretty dang cheap
Adthay
Yeah but now Google is backing out on all that so everywhere else has to wait a while to get that goodness
JapAnus
Didn't the charter companies pay google a crap ton to back off or am I misinformed?
Adthay
no idea, my understanding of events is that google just didn't have the physical infrastructure they needed but I'm no export
Tikityler
I love my google fiber. I make my housing decisions based on google fiber locations now.
Jameszombob
i used to sell charter (one of those annoying guys who calls you to bundle) AMA! charter sux btw
GeorgeHWBushsGhost
How is it that communications companies can be the only providers in certain areas? Do they have contracts with local governments?
Xplode441
Because smaller companies can't afford to lay lines in certain areas because of fees they'd owe the local government to lay lines.
Jameszombob
non competition agreements with other competitors. we werent allowed to sell to people who had time warner or comcast
Steincloth
This is stupid. People need water to live, not the Internet. Furthermore, you want the government controlling flow of information like that?
BoltActionGearbox
And you trust Comcast more? Government agencies contain elected officials, Comcast has mob bosses who straight extort Netfilix w/ blackmail
badgerthewitness
I sure as hell don't.
Ogagaga
Yes. Then the flow would at least be under democratic control.
Steincloth
That is not how it would work
omgwtfhuh
We need internet to live a modern life. All our rent and utilities have to be paid online, no other option. Also have to have it for work.
archwaykitten
i want the internet to keep getting better. That is encouraged by competition.
ZacWasTaken
The internet is way to important to democracy to allows the govornment to control it
petekron
Not when companies have an agreement between themselves to offer shit internet at sky-high prices, like how it is where I live.
LumburgOR
Does Comcast compete against itself?
newsguycraigevans
Yes, because major corps never collude to keep prices artificially high.
Zordicron
Yup, EXCEPT MOST OF THE USA DOESN'T HAVE ANY. Anything outside of major metro you get who you get, whoever owns the lines.
idonotthinkitownswhatyouthinkitowns
But competition is not fostered by a lack of regulation. Also big infrastructure like the inter-pipes tends towards monopoly.
valen00
competition doesn't work in natural monopolies. Last mile access network is one of those. How many power grids do you have? road networks
valen00
The reason being as more players enter the game they get fewer customers yet the cost of running the network past them remains the same
Clockworkdancerobot
Would be nice if we had some.
myingling
So remove the barriers to entry artificially put into place which grant current-day monopolies.
Clockworkdancerobot
All for it. Problem is they are locked in on a mostly local level, and fight anyone trying to put their own lines up. See: AT&T vs Google.
myingling
Hence why people need to run for seats in their local areas :) Your county comptroller (probably) has more impact on your life than Trump.
hwatL4bloopy
What competition?
LumburgOR
In my area I can choose between Comcast, Comcast, and Comcast.
hwatL4bloopy
Ooh joy.
mindscape00
As an Arizonan I can guarantee that most of my state lacks any form of 'competition' in the ISP area. The internet here is actually --
mindscape00
(2) degrading in terms of quality for price. Especially ping. Only the highest paying ($100+/m) get any advancement in speed and such here.
newsguycraigevans
I wish more people understood this. The US in general gets gouged on garbage like this.
StLeibowitz1
Yes, the state and city govs grant monopolies to ISPs. It's a government-made problem but somehow people expect more government to fix it.
Zordicron
That isn't always true. My town has been trying to get other companies to come in, but none wish to invest because lines are private owned1/
Zordicron
have a gov't run internet type ISP. This allows two things: provides a standard applicable to all areas, and also competition 3/
Zordicron
so other company has to run their own new ones. The sentiment is either to force the monopoly ISP to meet a standard, or, use tax money to2/
StLeibowitz1
The lack of competition then allows the monopolies to fuck you over as much as they want. When something like Google Fiber comes to town
StLeibowitz1
prices plummet and quality skyrockets cause now they have to fight for customers.
Zordicron
for the private sector. Example: gov't offers free 10mb/sec paid by taxes. Customer can get more bandwidth through private ISP for $$. /end
mindscape00
Arizona standards atm: I pay $56/m for 15mbs..
Zordicron
Thats fine, in your case the private ISP would provide a better service at the cost of monthly $. The gov't line would provide 1/
Zordicron
both competition to make sure your ISP keeps its ducks in a row, and also another option for other customers in your area. /end
MagicSquid
Except it's not. The internet companies have carved up the US into districts that they service. It's illegal, but hey, fuck legality $$$$
johnvictor
30% of people have a choice of 2 ISPs only, another 30% have only one ISP to choose from. Majority of the country has little competition.
cogitoro
But here's the thing, reduced government involvement ≠more competition. Even Ayn Rand understood this. We're not talking about two bakers
cogitoro
competing across the street from each other here. Providing internet isn't opening a restaurant. It's never gonna be a true competition.
unknownSubscriber
But how would handing control over to the government offer a better alternative with faster improvement on bandwidth?
Zordicron
Gov't provided tax paid baseline net for "free". Sets both a quality standard, and creates competition to all ISP. Example to follow /1
unknownSubscriber
That's not handing control over to the government, thats just forcing people to provide pay for internet.
Zordicron
Example: gov't puts in 10mb/sec net, paid by taxes, free. Private ISP can provide more bandwidth for $$. /end
skipweasel
Or at the very least have a monopolies commission with some serious teeth. It actually seems to work fairly well in the UK done like thta.
DespiseEveryone
That is why the UK has the fastest internet in Europe... well maybe it will work for your rail network...
mibakr
I think that is properly the best solution.
PirateRubberDuck
My cable internet speed is 2mb I'm not convinced.
skipweasel
Would I be right in thinking you've chosen to live out of town?
PirateRubberDuck
No you would be dead wrong. The building right behind me had fibre which makes it pretty stupid that it isn't available for me.
valen00
lol dude you got FTTN rather than full fibre because of that crap
Waitingforthedarknes
Internet works fine here good speeds and it's cheap and all isps are unlimited
lambaroo
in terms of internet, it has worked fairly ok, but they've also sold vital national infrastructure to foreign owners too
lambaroo
nhs support services, rails, roads, even water. things are fked when your rail system is subsidising other countries' cheaper national rail
lambaroo
and that list is just a small portion of what the tories have flogged off for peanuts to satisfy a fked ideology
kimadactyl
the post office was gonna make nationalised fibre internet in the 80s (i think). thatcher blocked it. the fucker.
njullpointer
BT is a major shit to everyone though. they 'lose the keys' on the last mile boxes all the fucking time. OFCOM needs MORE teeth.
AbsolutelyNotTheNSA
We have one provider of true fibre optic broadband, and countless others who offer fibre which maxes out at 70-ish mbit.
AbsolutelyNotTheNSA
70 is more than most, I know. But we still don't have much choice.
blarghl
funnily the UK's ISP situation is still a shitshow compared to other west european countries. BT both owns the last mile and is a reseller.
dashers
I think I read the other day that they've just ordered the legal split of BT and Openreach.
skipweasel
BT doesn't own my last mile - we're in a Virgin (ex-Telewest) cabled area.
blarghl
you're right, my bad. it's a duopoly, not a monopoly.
blarghl
see http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/09/17/bt-and-virgin-media-join-forces-to-battle-openreach-split/
RikkUK
Working in UK Telecoms, I can tell you that OFCOM does not have teeth as far as monopolies go
SomewhatOxygenated
I thought it was the European Commission that busted the mobile phone monopolies?
RikkUK
Only really in terms of EU voice and data roaming charges
CISMaleScumLord
But the monopolies commission or the Competition and Markets Authority as it's now called, does. OFCOM is more about disputes. I don't 1/2
CISMaleScumLord
know for sure how serious OFCOM's teeth are but OFGEM terrify the power companies. I had to get them into a dispute and one of the big 2/3
CISMaleScumLord
six just rolled over and caved. It felt glorious.
RikkUK
It's a similar story for both, it's not worth fighting small claims with OF(whatever), but they do little to stop price collusion.
underlord2132
Better than the US at least, where you have one choice of company or nothing in alot of places.
BambinoBambino
Where I live in CT you have two choices... Of course prices are absurdly high
Haxbrygd
I live in a rural state and I have a minimum of five choices. Where the hell do you live?
Summonsays
My parents can have either AOL dialup, satalie, or Windstream DSL. They have Windstream, charged $80ish a month 1/2
Summonsays
gets horrible speeds, think its about 0.5mbs down, and it cuts out for hours at a time on daily basis.
DevilInTheDetails
cities. Entire 15 story apt buildings only wired for Comcast.
Haxbrygd
Weird. When I lived in Dallas, I could have Time Warner, AT&T, Verizon or Windstream. Other areas had different providers, but still.
skipweasel
Isn't that more down the the building owners, not the communications authorities?
LassKibble
40% of the US has one provider for internet. It's not a small number and it is a problem.
AikoMizushima
There are laws in many places regarding "essential services". There is talk of making the Internet one of them.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Nepuu
Hopefully that turns into a standard in a few years
Kumquatz
Guess which U.S. political party is in favor of privatizing and monetizing the internet?
tentaclefriendly
In the last administration, yeah. This one is glad they get to carve it up and sell it off to the highest bidder.
sticksosteel
Everyone deserves high speed, high definition porn
voltlunok
Finally, someone talking about the big issues! This guys gets it! +1
mechanicalchaos
Fun fact! When the government runs something it has even more restrictions and rules placed on it!
Sintobus
Well a keystone of a strong capitalism/democracy is having an ever increasing load of highly skilled labor.
Penguinsruletheworld
Net Neutrality was the first step to it and Ajit Pai is tearing it apart. Call your congressmen Get trump Impeached now.
oskiee
That won't matter. You'll still have a Republican president, and Ajit will still be head of the fcc.
priestsaresotouchy
It sure would solve a lot of other problems though.
Arktisherz557
I think it was up for Common Carrier Class 2, which makes way more sense, imho
hookerbot5000
not gonna happen in the US with the new FCC chair and President Cheeto Mussolini
SomewhatOxygenated
Those laws effectively just turn these services into monopolies
slack3rdav3
wont happen in the next four years.
TheRaiderofRandom
I could've sworn that already happened. The FCC classified ISPs as common carriers under Title II of the 1934 Comms Act, but 1/
TheRaiderofRandom
the FCC avoided lawsuit by invoking forbearance, meaning ISPs aren't required to follow the regulations which have been applied. 2/2
Anarric
The Electric Co-op I work for is in the works of providing Fiber internet to our members. We are waiting for state legislation to pass
milchig
Talk is cheap. Do you have a source? I'm not trying to be an ass I'm genuinely curious
40rodstothehogshead
Especially considering its already signed into law that the US govt must establish and maintain GPS systems, this doesn't seem far off
Ten10868
Not anymore. Talos help us
matyles
I live where there is only one high-speed provider so they charge 85 bucks for unlimited
Zordicron
I have Frontier. 110 for me. 4mb DL and 128k(yes, not mb, k) UL.
matyles
I'm lucky enough to live close enough to the "city" A bit farther out and its low speed and expensive. Or unavailable.
Zordicron
That's very common, and IMO why this discussion about net access comes up so often. Most of the USA is still in the 90's tech wise.
crumplestiltskin
Some states have already done so. I think cali has it listed as utility for certain protections
JustSayingYouHaventSeenMeAndBatmanInTheSameRoomBefore
Yeah good fuckin luck with that. Comcast has switched to "data plans" so they can try to make up money from losing business to streaming TV
matyles
I live where its sudden link and they do they same
Masticause
Same thing here in Missouri with Cableone. They never talk about their data cap, until you hit it
ThomasMontgomeryHaverford
The US Department of Homeland Security considers the Internet critical infrastructure: https://www.dhs.gov/information-technology-sector
AikoMizushima
For a different purpose, but does suit the need. Critical services can be commandeered in an emergency.
ThomasMontgomeryHaverford
Yeah, no. CI is infrastructure critical to the functioning of the economy or national security. That means DHS can provide federal funding 1
ThomasMontgomeryHaverford
(DHS also considers the food, transportation, and water systems, among others, to be CI as well). 3/
ThomasMontgomeryHaverford
to identify and address potential vulnerabilities that could compromise the use of those services. 2/
interrobangster
In switzerland we have 2 MB/s internet for free.
JamesBondMegacorn
BYTES or bits?
interrobangster
Upps, should have been a small b. Bits it is
NamelessAndrew
It's still pretty good for the price of free.
spatmycheesecurds
In my town in good ole Canada, we have started low income "basic" internet for 10$ a month, roughly gets you 25mb/s upload and 50gb download
thefa11guy
50gb download limit seems harsh And I very much doubt you mean 50 Gbps. I pay roughly $18 for 72Mbps down, 20Mbps up
Zordicron
I have Frontier. I pay 110 a month for 4mb DL and 128K(not a typo) UL. I get roughly 200k DL average. I have no other option for provider.
Oblivionox09
I pay $20/ month and I'm lucky if I get 1mb upload and 5mb download... Home of the free, my ass!
DICEM4N
We pay $100 and get 500kb/s download and idk how much upload.
Oblivionox09
I'm so sorry
DICEM4N
It's ok
BattloidKouji
Not in this administration. Plus they're actively seeking to overturn net neutrality.
thorinsbeard
No they aren't. Read Forbes magazine, they have a piece on it.
Tonberryc
I had to look up that article. That is some horrifically biased writing, and the author clearly did very little research on Net Neutrality.
sorosfieldops
I find it ironic that the 4chan free speech candidate is gonna hand the internet over to the corporations.
AikoMizushima
Yeah, campaign contributors include telcos. However, if it starts happening elsewhere in the west, the US might get it too
MrJLK
Like free health care?
UndercoverDuck15
Or gun control?
pirihannu
http://imgur.com/KA59tez Shut up hippie.
r0bber
There's gun control, just look at how much it helps Chicago:) just remember, when firearms are outlawed, only outlaws will be armed
Odentay
In canada the internet waa just recently declared a utility and they have set minimum standards that all citizens must have aceess too
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zFUBARz
Bell already had those laws in place for phones. legally had to provide service for many years.
GeorgeTheHero
I'm remember reading about how most places in America count it as a utility as well
SinsOftheErectPhoenix
that's it I'm moving to canada
Steamwick
Finland has it as a basic human right first on the planet, unaware if others have followed suit after Finland.
Ghobe
And I bet your minimum is better than my best option...sigh...
Greatwood
God damn Canada is going for that cultural victory
Postthepost
Can't help it when the other civs are dicking around ;)
HighImpactSexualViolence
Especially since America and Russia specced so heavy into a try for military win in the early game.
PolishSpaceProgram
r/UnexpectedCiv
NougatFromOrbit
Too bad Canada isn't a thing in Civ :(
Greatwood
Quebec city is
NougatFromOrbit
"Quebec City has won the culture victory"
newworldtraveller
Rantaf
This gif hasn't been funny since 2012. Everytime somebody references ANYTHING it gets posted by karma whoring users. For shame! Be original.
PhilipCoulson
Your amount of downvotes inclines me to believe that most people disagree with you on that
TheDankWankster
Greatwood
newworldtraveller
I've heard about people like you... You've made my day not as good. Enjoy your day.
NiHZ
KevinMenzel
Unfortunately there's no practical way for those standards to be met.
69NAZ
1Finland is relatively widespread populationwise also. Everyone is guaranteed 2mbps (they're upping it to 10 in near future i think). Rural
69NAZ
2areas are provided with 4G network (ikstead of adsl/vdsl/fiber etc). Every major operator are increasing focus on making 4g network more
Odentay
For a majority of the populace, its not unreasonable. my parents live 15 minutes outside of a small country town 1/?
Himser
they have 1.2 gbps wireless transceivers. its definitely possible. https://www.ubnt.com/airfiber/airfiber/
Odentay
theyre likly never going to be able to reach the speeds that the CRTC wants everyone to reach. at least 2/?
Odentay
not without an ENOURMOUS expendature oin behalf of the companies. but some of the standards even for them are reachable 3/?
69NAZ
3 reliable. Also, we really don't have data limits, some operators adjust your dl speed after XX gb of transfer. 3/4g i mean. Finito.
KevinMenzel
Yeah, in Canada you don't really have unlimited - a few carriers with bad coverage and slow speeds offer it - but like - you get...
KevinMenzel
about 10GB max before you're throttled slower than dial-up speeds. So yeah actually the tech would probably work but...
Techtronic
I wish they would have held back on LTE until they got 4G all handled because I live in a dead zone. We need a booster in the house to 1/2
Techtronic
Use our cell phones. Even then, the connection is spotty at best. 2/2
Techtronic
That said, we do have a home phone but my parents still use their cell phones a lot for work
travishay
Yes, and it means your internet costs are going to go up, so a farm in the middle of Manitoba can get 50mb/s
zFUBARz
Really cause mine just dropped by about $10 per month because of laws like that one. Maybe get off Rogers/Bell/Shaw/Telus.
travishay
Yours dropped because you're using a re-seller, and the CRTC said they have to sell to re-sellers at wholesale rates. It's not sustainable.
zFUBARz
Fair and competitive pricing isn't sustainable?
mildlyinappropriate
I'm on board if that means a more informed populace.
travishay
Don't get me wrong, I agree. I just don't think everyone in Canada has a need for 50mbs.
Thefakeplant
I don't think that's how that works, oversimplificatinator.
travishay
I work for Bell, they're implementing a $5/month price increase on internet to pay for the infrastructure they'll have to build.
Ghobe
Not $5! Oh woe are your people. I have to drink a whole beer less a month now!