Orwell shown a totalitarian distopic future that still can have people with a spark of imagination of a possible alternative to that world. Huxley shown a distant future from Orwell’s one, where the victory of the previous totalitarian regime eradicated that spark using chemicals and social control. It did it so deeply that it became the normality. As nowadays is capitalism, which we can barely imagine an efficiently working society without it.
There is a mathematical formula for exploiting people. Basically, it shows what your limit is to how much comfort & entertainment you need to allow yourself to be exploited.
The pandemic cancelling a lot of these pursuits created a whole generation of protesters. Stay at home orders are issued and the NBA and NHL cancel or postpone their seasons in mid March and the George Floyd protests begin in April, then counter protests. I'd argue that the GF protests would have still happened because of the egregious nature of the arrest but would have been much smaller. I think we never wouldn't heard the name Kyle Rittenhouse though.
it continues: "All that was required of them was a primitive patriotism which could be appealed to whenever it was necessary to make them accept longer working hours or shorter rations." OH THIS DOESNT SOUND FAMILIAR AT ALL!
And algorithms, Ai and 15 second social media bombardment configured to hook children and adults alike are making this task entirely too easy. Get em while they are young and you have caught them for life, sadly.
While dystopian fiction may seem prophetic, it was mostly a case of the writers exaggerating things that already existed in their time. Or just taking things that already happen to marginalized populations and applying those things to people with privilege.
If, for instance, transgender people are constantly harassed for doing the most basic things (even pee), that's just life. If the same thing happens to, also random example, Christians, that's dystopian.
"The founding of North Korea happened around the time 1984 was published. And you'd think the founders were handed a copy and asked: "do you think we could make this fly?" And they answered: "I'm not sure but we can give it the old college try"" -Christopher Hitchens
In some cities that was borderline revolution as law enforcement and government was either corrupted or came close to losing control - maybe generalising Orwell's statement to "provide sufficient comforts, regardless of how hollow, to occupy their minds, and control is not difficult". Similar to Marx's "opiate of the masses" about religion
I think the far right just don't understand what "sufficient comforts" are; they could probably get away with gutting education if we all had free healthcare, low rent, and affordable food. Unfortunately for them, the people who want the latter three are also the people who want the former.
I would argue that "sufficient comforts" varies with time and extends far beyond basics such as food/healthcare/housing/education and definitely includes sports/entertainment/religion/gambling/alcohol/drugs/travel/social mobility etc. As a non-American, I see the differing political spheres having very different views on what "sufficient comforts" entails, often inspite of their own individual interests
Money got weed banned, technically. Logging or paper companies or some shit were threatened by the hemp industry, they piggybacked weed into the temperance movement (reefer madness) and ran with the rascism of association of cannabis with PoC. Then it snowballed into the lock up all the brown people for drugs thing until just recently (though they're still getting locked up despite most addicts being white rurals on opiates)
Well, the wild stuff was smoked by Mexican labourers....then later on black jazz musicians. Jazz was the devil's music at the time because it got pretty white girls to drop their panties. So you had to make sure you banned it, or those women would have uncontrollable urges that would be taken advantage of by jazz musicians.
This is true, these sorts of distractions make revolution (change) impossible. On top of that, they (rich and powerful) keep you fat with fast food and processed crap. And they keep us dumb with these screens in our hands. Plus all the misinformation makes us distrust anything we don't instinctively like.... Middle class America you got fucked over, end of story. Voting ain't going to save you and you are too pathetic to revolt. -Laughing Rich Guy
I feel like we have a part of responsibility for letting them get us dumb. We could forsake stupid reality shiws and watch scientific / educztional videos but no. The media wants money and they feed us what we want. And aparently what wd want is stupid shit
I'm sick of hearing this bullshit and I no longer care to be polite about it. People aren't being distracted, the news is constant and omnipresent. Everyone knows what the rich and powerful are doing. Everyone knows about the corruption, it's not even remotely hidden. Nobody is being tricked, they are choosing not to see it or they just don't care. The followers and apathetic are just as much to blame. The screens you deride for keeping people dumb contain all the world's knowledge,
The people who use them see what they choose. Smart people use them to do smart shit, dumb people use them to do dumb shit. 1984 was only prophetic because society doesn't change at its core. The "Spanish Flu" had anti-vaxxers, populism gains popularity by targeting minorities. Always has done. Ironically, pseudo-intellectuals blaming the latest technology has always happened too.
Remember during covid when we had no sports going on and the black lives matter protests were going strong? Those in charge were real quick to get basketball on TV asap. Then the protests died down shortly after. We were on the verge of real change and then the circus was put back in place
I suspect fatigue was part of it. In some parts of the country it had become an actual war zone with white supremacists and cops. People were injured and tired and wanted to get off the protest line and go home.
"What Orwell feared were those who would ban books. What Huxley feared was that there would be no reason to ban a book, for there would be no one who wanted to read one. Orwell feared those who would deprive us of information. Huxley feared those who would give us so much that we would be reduced to passivity and egoism. Orwell feared that the truth would be concealed from us. Huxley feared the truth would be drowned in a sea of irrelevance. Orwell feared we would become a captive culture. >
The issue with mouse utopia is that its a rorschach test. You see in it what you want to see. You can stretch your predisposition onto it and use the correlations to claim you're correct.
Huxley feared we would become a trivial culture, preoccupied with some equivalent of the feelies, the orgy porgy, and the centrifugal bumblepuppy. As Huxley remarked in Brave New World Revisited, the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions."
In 1984, Huxley added, "people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. >
In short, Orwell feared that what we hate will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we love will ruin us".” – Neil Postman, Amusing Ourselves to Death: Public Discourse in the Age of Show Business
brianingram
Bread & Roses
ZweihundeDev
Bread and Circuses.
lonelyrangerofthedreams
Orwell shown a totalitarian distopic future that still can have people with a spark of imagination of a possible alternative to that world. Huxley shown a distant future from Orwell’s one, where the victory of the previous totalitarian regime eradicated that spark using chemicals and social control. It did it so deeply that it became the normality. As nowadays is capitalism, which we can barely imagine an efficiently working society without it.
Quizz25S
Give it to them? Hell they'll PAY for it. The entertainment industry is a multi billion dollar industry.
Kilkaranoga
Bread and circuses...
stevekemerer
Yeah, well, they boycotted football and now beer so is gambling next? Whodathought gay/trans would save the day.
otamolot
Shake the jar and make them argue about everything.
HeywouldJablowme
I thought this was Huxley and a brave new world?
3PiecesOfBread
"Hey baby are you ready for the revolution?"
Grimmrog
Make people pay to work hard and get useless payouts.
tonyiscariot
This post brought to you by Jamie Foxx and BetMGM!
BoofBoofPass
Amen.
Rendova
Just buy some fiddle spinners.
slayston
Imgr the last bastion of independent thought and freedom, no screens or distractions here.
BillHubbard
Glad I don't watch sports don't gamble and don't drink beer. Wine on the other hand...
vhanW
There is a mathematical formula for exploiting people. Basically, it shows what your limit is to how much comfort & entertainment you need to allow yourself to be exploited.
joechristo
It was supposed to be a cautionary tale, not an oligarchal instruction manual.
HeroThatWasNeeded
Sometimes it feels like people care more about the circuses than getting at the ones storing the bread away from us.
Inmate45
Panem et circenses - tale as old as time.
CaptSchmidtGaming
Only thing orwell got wrong was that it was us who bought cameras. and our only fear would be that no-one was watching.
RockKickass
I’d like to reread it instead of live it
BrownestofCoats
The pandemic cancelling a lot of these pursuits created a whole generation of protesters. Stay at home orders are issued and the NBA and NHL cancel or postpone their seasons in mid March and the George Floyd protests begin in April, then counter protests. I'd argue that the GF protests would have still happened because of the egregious nature of the arrest but would have been much smaller. I think we never wouldn't heard the name Kyle Rittenhouse though.
JohnWickdidnothingwrong
1984 wasn't a prediction of the future, it was an assessment of the present.
joechristo
it continues: "All that was required of them was a primitive patriotism which could be appealed to whenever it was necessary to make them accept longer working hours or shorter rations." OH THIS DOESNT SOUND FAMILIAR AT ALL!
Murmull
And algorithms, Ai and 15 second social media bombardment configured to hook children and adults alike are making this task entirely too easy. Get em while they are young and you have caught them for life, sadly.
Shaodyn
While dystopian fiction may seem prophetic, it was mostly a case of the writers exaggerating things that already existed in their time. Or just taking things that already happen to marginalized populations and applying those things to people with privilege.
Shaodyn
If, for instance, transgender people are constantly harassed for doing the most basic things (even pee), that's just life. If the same thing happens to, also random example, Christians, that's dystopian.
echoawoo
1984 and the Handmaid's Tale aren't warnings of dystopias to them, they're instructional manuals.
andybandy
"The founding of North Korea happened around the time 1984 was published. And you'd think the founders were handed a copy and asked: "do you think we could make this fly?" And they answered: "I'm not sure but we can give it the old college try"" -Christopher Hitchens
Daskiel91
Rational fears that were made as warning, and made into manuals by those in power
DRockchild
Thanks George and Margaret. /s
TapiocaMartini
They're starting to be historical documents. Especially in Florida.
Malinut
Tragically this is acting out in the UK exactly as planned by treacherous cunts like J R-M.
Rincewind4224
Yeah! Not at all like us aimlessly scrolling imgur.
5ourgrape5
The irony of this post and the comments 🤯
BTanner13000
Imgur is infamous for people endlessly bitching about social media.
palonoctisursa
Give them bread and the circus, and the masses will never revolt
varyael
Remember when temperance got weed, gambling, and alcohol illegalized and then people opened speakeasies anyway?
bripi
I do. I was in Canada at the time, but I recall this from my fucky southern brother.
SheepySleepySmuggler
In some cities that was borderline revolution as law enforcement and government was either corrupted or came close to losing control - maybe generalising Orwell's statement to "provide sufficient comforts, regardless of how hollow, to occupy their minds, and control is not difficult". Similar to Marx's "opiate of the masses" about religion
FallingStar7669
I think the far right just don't understand what "sufficient comforts" are; they could probably get away with gutting education if we all had free healthcare, low rent, and affordable food. Unfortunately for them, the people who want the latter three are also the people who want the former.
SheepySleepySmuggler
I would argue that "sufficient comforts" varies with time and extends far beyond basics such as food/healthcare/housing/education and definitely includes sports/entertainment/religion/gambling/alcohol/drugs/travel/social mobility etc. As a non-American, I see the differing political spheres having very different views on what "sufficient comforts" entails, often inspite of their own individual interests
HonestCommentFarmer
Temperance didn't get weed banned. Racism and opportunistic politicians got weed banned.
varyael
Money got weed banned, technically. Logging or paper companies or some shit were threatened by the hemp industry, they piggybacked weed into the temperance movement (reefer madness) and ran with the rascism of association of cannabis with PoC. Then it snowballed into the lock up all the brown people for drugs thing until just recently (though they're still getting locked up despite most addicts being white rurals on opiates)
NotaCPA
Well, the wild stuff was smoked by Mexican labourers....then later on black jazz musicians. Jazz was the devil's music at the time because it got pretty white girls to drop their panties. So you had to make sure you banned it, or those women would have uncontrollable urges that would be taken advantage of by jazz musicians.
CutChemist
So true. Mexicans and blacks. Something about stamps too (not postal stamps)
GiantMoron
This is true, these sorts of distractions make revolution (change) impossible. On top of that, they (rich and powerful) keep you fat with fast food and processed crap. And they keep us dumb with these screens in our hands. Plus all the misinformation makes us distrust anything we don't instinctively like.... Middle class America you got fucked over, end of story. Voting ain't going to save you and you are too pathetic to revolt. -Laughing Rich Guy
Gorzine
I feel like we have a part of responsibility for letting them get us dumb. We could forsake stupid reality shiws and watch scientific / educztional videos but no. The media wants money and they feed us what we want. And aparently what wd want is stupid shit
Gorzine
Sorry for the typos, stupid butter fingers and crappy vision
itsameeeee
how dumb they make us is one part they cant control easily. But its very easy for human to be lazy.
ProfaneSanction
That was too stupid to be chat gpt
Jawesome19
Yes it's a conspiracy and not just a bunch of assholes making tons of money
ManOCheese
I'm sick of hearing this bullshit and I no longer care to be polite about it. People aren't being distracted, the news is constant and omnipresent. Everyone knows what the rich and powerful are doing. Everyone knows about the corruption, it's not even remotely hidden. Nobody is being tricked, they are choosing not to see it or they just don't care. The followers and apathetic are just as much to blame. The screens you deride for keeping people dumb contain all the world's knowledge,
ManOCheese
The people who use them see what they choose. Smart people use them to do smart shit, dumb people use them to do dumb shit. 1984 was only prophetic because society doesn't change at its core. The "Spanish Flu" had anti-vaxxers, populism gains popularity by targeting minorities. Always has done. Ironically, pseudo-intellectuals blaming the latest technology has always happened too.
suffyr
Remember during covid when we had no sports going on and the black lives matter protests were going strong? Those in charge were real quick to get basketball on TV asap. Then the protests died down shortly after. We were on the verge of real change and then the circus was put back in place
ThatRaccoonGuy
I suspect fatigue was part of it. In some parts of the country it had become an actual war zone with white supremacists and cops. People were injured and tired and wanted to get off the protest line and go home.
SunBrolem
Since we're quoting Orwell up in here: "The fastest way to end a war is lose."
Jawesome19
Lmfao dear god
varyael
Deer god (not my art)
PballQhead
"What Orwell feared were those who would ban books. What Huxley feared was that there would be no reason to ban a book, for there would be no one who wanted to read one. Orwell feared those who would deprive us of information. Huxley feared those who would give us so much that we would be reduced to passivity and egoism. Orwell feared that the truth would be concealed from us. Huxley feared the truth would be drowned in a sea of irrelevance. Orwell feared we would become a captive culture. >
professionallazyperson
Along these same lines, I recommend people look up Calhoun’s “Mouse Utopia” experiment and compare/contrast it with modern-day human society.
Magyarharcos
The issue with mouse utopia is that its a rorschach test. You see in it what you want to see. You can stretch your predisposition onto it and use the correlations to claim you're correct.
professionallazyperson
How so?
Magyarharcos
https://sciencehistory.org/stories/magazine/mouse-heaven-or-mouse-hell/ I came to the conclusion when i first heard about it, then read up on it and found this. Least biased, most objective write-up on the topic IMO
PballQhead
Huxley feared we would become a trivial culture, preoccupied with some equivalent of the feelies, the orgy porgy, and the centrifugal bumblepuppy. As Huxley remarked in Brave New World Revisited, the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny "failed to take into account man's almost infinite appetite for distractions."
In 1984, Huxley added, "people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. >
Rimbox
Thank for for a very enjoyable read
1966flodur
You can see those in power in the west follow the Huxley line those in China the Orwell line.
PballQhead
In short, Orwell feared that what we hate will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we love will ruin us".” – Neil Postman, Amusing Ourselves to Death: Public Discourse in the Age of Show Business
PrincessWendyB
Very insightful
ruint
Unfortunately we got both in what Hideo Kojima feared, and is currently happening:
(Metal gear solid II, 1999)
Magyarharcos
Well, thats liquid wisdom right there, man....